Quote from: Paul Joseph Watson
Prison Planet
Wednesday, September 24, 2008
U.S. troops returning from duty in Iraq will be carrying out homeland patrols in America from October 1st in complete violation of Posse Comitatus for the purposes of helping with "civil unrest and crowd control" - which could include dealing with unruly Americans after a complete economic collapse.
This shocking admission was calmly reported on September 8th by the Army Times website, which reports that from the beginning of next month the 3rd Infantry Division's 1st Brigade Combat Team "Will be under the day-to-day control of U.S. Army North, the Army service component of Northern Command, as an on-call federal response force for natural or manmade emergencies and disasters, including terrorist attacks."
The article notes that the deployment "marks the first time an active unit has been given a dedicated assignment to NorthCom, a joint command established in 2002 to provide command and control for federal homeland defense efforts and coordinate defense support of civil authorities."
The purpose of the unit's patrols includes helping "with civil unrest and crowd control or to deal with potentially horrific scenarios such as massive poisoning and chaos in response to a chemical, biological, radiological, nuclear or high-yield explosive, or CBRNE, attack."
The unit will be on homeland patrol for at least 20 months before returning to Iraq or Afghanistan in early 2010, according to the report.
Training for homeland operations has already begun at Fort Stewart and at Peterson Air Force Base in Colorado Springs.
Ominously, the report states that, "The 1st BCT's soldiers also will learn how to use "the first ever nonlethal package that the Army has fielded," 1st BCT commander Col. Roger Cloutier said, referring to crowd and traffic control equipment and nonlethal weapons designed to subdue unruly or dangerous individuals without killing them."
The unit would also be deployed to deal with hostile crowds of Americans in the aftermath of a massive economic depression, potential food riots and race riots, if one defines the term "crowd control" to match its reasonably applicable scenarios.
The open admission that U.S. troops will be involved in law enforcement operations as well as potentially using non-lethal weapons against American citizens is a complete violation of the Posse Comitatus Act and the Insurrection Act, which substantially limit the powers of the federal government to use the military for law enforcement unless under precise and extreme circumstances.
Section 1385 of the Posse Comitatus Act states, "Whoever, except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress, willfully uses any part of the Army or the Air Force as a posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both."
Under the John Warner Defense Authorization Act, signed by President Bush on October 17, 2006, the law was changed to state, "The President may employ the armed forces to restore public order in any State of the United States the President determines hinders the execution of laws or deprives people of a right, privilege, immunity, or protection named in the Constitution and secured by law or opposes or obstructs the execution of the laws of the United States or impedes the course of justice under those laws."
However, these changes were repealed in their entirety by HR 4986: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2008, reverting back to the original state of the Insurrection Act of 1807.
The original text of the Insurrection Act severely limits the power of the President to deploy troops within the United States.
For troops to be deployed, a condition has to exist that, "(1) So hinders the execution of the laws of that State, and of the United States within the State, that any part or class of its people is deprived of a right, privilege, immunity, or protection named in the Constitution and secured by law, and the constituted authorities of that State are unable, fail, or refuse to protect that right, privilege, or immunity, or to give that protection; or (2) opposes or obstructs the execution of the laws of the United States or impedes the course of justice under those laws. In any situation covered by clause (1), the State shall be considered to have denied the equal protection of the laws secured by the Constitution."
Is the Bush administration and Northcom waiting for such a scenario to unfold, an event that completely overwhelms state authorities, before unleashing the might of the U.S. Army against the American people?
The deployment of National Guard troops to aid law enforcement or for disaster relief purposes is legal under the authority of the governor of a state, but using active duty U.S. Army in law enforcement operations inside America absent the conditions described in the Insurrection Act is completely illegal.
With the promise of an "October surprise" on behalf of Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda being bandied about by the media and the potential for civil unrest should a complete collapse of the U.S. economy unfold, the presence of U.S. troops inside America, returning fresh from kicking down doors, arresting "insurgents" and taking them to internment camps in Iraq, should put Americans on alert and provoke urgent questions about the legality of U.S. Army units engaging in law enforcement operations against American citizens.
......we're fucked.
Stop reading alex jones related websites.
IF........IF the military is going to be used as a law enforcement agency on US soil. That is a huge violation of Posse Comitatus. That is completely un constitutional. This is not the Job of the US military.
the steps are being taken, gradually and unnoticed
yes, we are fucked
if something is unconstitutional, it shouldn't happen....but hey nowadays you never know
it wont matter when the North American Union dissolves the constitution
Conditions are just getting worse and worse.
And there really isn't anything we can do about it.
Quote from: Oldnewtype on Sep 24, 2008, 09:01 PM
Paul Joseph Watson
Prison Planet
Wednesday, September 24, 2008]
U.S. troops returning from duty in Iraq will be carrying out homeland patrols in America from October 1st in complete violation of Posse Comitatus for the purposes of helping with "civil unrest and crowd control" - which could include dealing with unruly Americans after a complete economic collapse.
You know, I'd like to be angry about this taking place (if and when it does), but we have no one to blame but ourselves. Civil unrest shouldn't take place in the aftermath of an economic collapse, unrest should be a force in preventing it, as well as anything else that we see problems with. More and more, people are too wiling to sit back and figure that someone else (meaning the gov't) will just handle everything. This is not the case. And we're all just waking up out of our materialistic brainwash, and becoming aware of it when it's a little too late.
Americans (in general) are like a bunch of spoiled bratty kids who quickly deny themselves of responsibility because they figure Mommy and Daddy (the gov't) will take care of everything for them. If some of us put as much effort into keeping our own system of "checks and balances" with our gov't, as we do with fighting over x-boxes for our kid's christmas present, or making sure we Tivo the latest episode of dancing with the stars,things wouldn't be panning out the way they are.
Right, we should be blaming ourselves as well as the government. But not for the civil unrest, that is only natural. I think we should be blaming ourselves for the 2nd point you brought up. Our own ignorance.
There is an overwhelming amount of literature on economics. Brilliant economist have been warning us of the evils of the federal reserve for a very long time. But no one cared to know. No one cares to pay attention. They all think it is too complicated and just want to focus on their every day lives and just trust the government to do the right thing. Even though that is exactly what our forefathers DID NOT do, and exactly what they warned us NOT TO DO. So the government remains unchecked. These people who appose the federal government are black balled in the media. The only real source Americans get their information from. Because they are too lazy to pick up a book and read.
Obviously this kind of thing takes place in our government in more than just the Federal Reserve. However that seems to be the topic at hand, so that is why I am speaking about that. But also, most Americans probably don't even know what Posse Comitatus is. They probably don't know that it is illegal for the military to be used as law enforcement on US soil. So who is going to hold the government accountable if the people are ignorant? A hand full of educated people can be black balled and shut out. If everyone was informed, you could not silence the entire population of America taking a stand for their civil liberties and freedoms.
Its time to quit being lazy and stupid. It is time to get off your ass and read. It is time to get informed. It is time to let small, insignificant issues go. Our founding fathers did not have to risk everything they had in order to establish this country. They could have ate shit their whole lives. Realized they were more well to do than most of the Colonials and really wouldn't have to take any action. But they did take a stand, even though they didn't have to, and it could have meant their lives. They had families and aspirations and comforts too. But the #1 reason they were able to accomplish anything that they did. Was not that they were determined to fight ( there is plenty of that in most of us ) it was their extensive educations. They were extremely educated men. They knew the issues, they knew the way things worked. Through that they were able to inspire, and eventually lead the nation. They wrote an Amazing document called the constitution. Now, because of our lack of education. That document has been bastardized and ignored. Its time to get educated people. Seriously, fucking read something.
^ BRAVO!
Dude, this is what we have been warning about this whole summer dude. The FISA bill, Patriot Act, "terrorists will come in all colors soon", Lieberman wanting to get rid of any anti-govt videos off of youtube, Blackwater, etc etc.
Let's abolish the Federal Reserve!
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/63821
and here is the bill:
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h110-2755
i just had to check the board before i went to bed didnt i
yes sir. I don't think its appropriate to enter a state of panic and start worrying about stocking up on weapons and canned food. But it is way past due to start getting educated and taking certain issues very serious. Also way past due to quit letting our elected officials do whatever they want with no accountability. Once you have the education, you have the power to recognize what is wrong and demand it gets changed.
Since Dr. Ron Paul has been publicly backing Chuck Baldwin as of late, Chuck Baldwin wanted to make his thank you public...
Thank you, Dr. Ron Paul
by Chuck Baldwin
Yesterday, September 22, Congressman Ron Paul publicly gave me his endorsement for the office of President of the United States. In his blog at the Campaign for Liberty web site, he said, "I'm supporting Chuck Baldwin, the Constitution Party candidate." (See the complete statement)
Obviously, I could not be more delighted and honored to have Dr. Paul's endorsement. I called him last evening and thanked him personally. And now I want to thank him publicly.
I am fully aware that Dr. Paul was under considerable pressure from various groups that were actively soliciting his support. I can honestly say that I never lobbied Dr. Paul for his endorsement. He knew I would be thrilled to have it, but I have too much respect for Ron Paul to be so presumptuous as to expect him to endorse me. I completely understood his neutrality. He has strong ties to both the Libertarian and Constitution parties—not to mention the obvious fact that he is a ten-term Republican Congressman with much support from the Republican Party in his home district.
I was happy to support Ron Paul during the Republican primaries, because I believe in the same principles. I personally campaigned for him in several states and in this column. And I asked (or expected) nothing in return. In fact, I have stated this publicly, time and again: if Ron Paul had won the Republican nomination for President, I would not be running. I would still be supporting Ron Paul.
I am running for President because the Republican Party rejected Ron's Paul's message of constitutional government, fiscal responsibility, and non-interventionism. Therefore, someone had to pick up the mantle and carry this message into the general election. The Constitution Party asked me to be their standard-bearer in order to bring this message to the American people in November. So, here I am. And now, Ron Paul's endorsement is further substantiation that the message of constitutional government will not die in 2008. The American people still have a real choice instead of the big-government, globalist, interventionist, "big box" party candidates, John McCain and Barack Obama.
Ron Paul's message is my message; Ron Paul's fight is my fight.
I want to return America to constitutional government. "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." (Amendment X) I believe that, and will govern the Executive branch of the federal government accordingly.
My sworn oath to the Tenth Amendment means I would dismantle the Patriot Act and restore law enforcement to the states and local governments, where it rightly belongs. Yes, this includes the so-called "war on drugs" and the so-called "war on terror." No more warrantless searches and seizures. No more eavesdropping on Americans' phone calls, or collecting Americans' emails, or spying on American citizens without court order and oversight. No more stripping Americans of their constitutional rights in the name of "national security." In addition, I would use every power and authority vested to my office to preserve and protect the right of the people to keep and bear arms. And, yes, I will immediately restore Posse Comitatus. As President, I want to protect America from Washington, D.C., as much I want to protect it from foreign powers.
I will also take the words of the Declaration of Independence seriously, where it states, "That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States." This means the day I am sworn in as President of the United States, the New World Order comes crashing down! The NAFTA superhighway is dead. The North American Union is dead. I will work to eliminate NAFTA, CAFTA, GATT, and the WTO. The FTAA is DOA. I will not expend tax dollars for the support of the United Nations.
Furthermore, I will take my oath to the Constitution seriously, when it states that one of the express purposes of the federal government is to "repel Invasions." This means we will secure America's borders, because the illegal immigration crisis is more than mere immigration: it is an invasion, and I will stop it! Even if I have to send the U.S. Army to the borders, we will put a stop to this invasion of illegal aliens. I will also aggressively prosecute those employers who knowingly hire illegals. And did I mention that my first day in office is Border Patrol Agents Ramos and Compean's last day in prison? I will personally open the prison doors and restore to these men their freedom. I will also give them their jobs back (with pay), if they want them. And one more item on this point: my first day of office is also U.S. Attorney Johnny Sutton's last day on the job.
I also share Ron Paul's concerns for the way the two major parties have allowed the United States to become a meddlesome, interventionist, nation-building empire for the sake of satisfying the greedy machinations of international bankers and power-hungry politicians. I will not only bring our troops home from Iraq and Afghanistan, but also from most of the other 130 nations that currently house U.S. forces. I will end foreign aid. I will get the U.S. out of NATO. It is past time for the European states to defend themselves. It is time for us to stop sticking our nose in every other nation's business and start taking care of the United States. The Warfare State will kill us. Global empires are not sustainable. I repeat: global empires are not sustainable. If history teaches anything, it teaches that.
Furthermore, the Bush doctrine of pre-emptive war is over, when I become President. Because I will take my oath to the Constitution seriously, I would never send troops to invade and occupy a foreign country without a Declaration of War by Congress. In dealing with rogue terrorist organizations such as al Qaeda, I will seek letters of Marque and Reprisal from Congress, which would give me the authority to use whatever special and/or private forces are necessary to seek out and destroy those who desire our hurt.
And even though I am a born again Christian (as is Ron Paul), I would take my responsibility to protect the religious liberty of every American seriously. People have the right to worship God (or not worship God) according to the dictates of their own conscience. Whether one is Baptist, Catholic, Mormon, or agnostic, people have the right to practice their faith as they see fit. I am absolutely dedicated to preserving religious liberty. Religious tyranny is as evil as political or social tyranny. And, as I will be no man's slave, neither will I be any man's master.
I also share Ron Paul's commitment to the sanctity of life. When I become President, I will use the bully pulpit of the White House to press Congress to pass Dr. Paul's Sanctity of Life Act, which would overturn Roe v. Wade and end abortion-on-demand. On this topic, the GOP is especially hypocritical. The Republican Party controlled the entire federal government for six years and did nothing to save the life of a single unborn child. Saving unborn babies from the abortionists' scalpel is more than rhetoric with me, however.
Another area of agreement with Ron Paul is my philosophy of economics. Dr. Paul has been predicting the current financial meltdown in this country for years. And when all is done, the current bailout being proposed will do more harm than good. The problem is, America's leaders have rejected sound money policies for years, and the chickens are coming home to roost. As President, I would seek to overturn the 16th Amendment, eliminate the Internal Revenue Service, and disband the Federal Reserve. I would lead the charge to return America to sound money principles. I would seek to reduce federal spending to constitutional levels by eliminating those same federal departments that Newt Gingrich promised to eliminate in his Contract with America back in 1994 (and then failed to do). I would seek to eliminate the Departments of Education, Commerce, Energy, etc. I would demand that Congress pass a balanced budget and that we stop deficit spending. Neither John McCain nor Barack Obama will do any of the above. If he were President, Dr. Paul would do it, however, and so would I. Needless to say, I am both humbled and honored that Ron Paul would place enough faith in me that he would endorse me for President. I can think of no higher compliment to my candidacy. I here and now publicly thank him for this vote of confidence. I know my Vice Presidential running mate, Darrell Castle (a former Marine Corps officer and Vietnam veteran), joins me in inviting all of Dr. Paul's supporters to help us take the message of constitutional government into the general election on November 4.
Thank you.
Posted by Cody Quirk in News, Letters, Campaign 2008, Ron Paul, Constitution Party, Presidential Race, Chuck Baldwin | 2 Comments »
Baldwin Thanks Paul, Affirms CP Platform
Posted by Brian Holtz --- September 24th, 2008
Quote from: Variable on Sep 25, 2008, 08:19 AMI don't think its appropriate to enter a state of panic and start worrying about stocking up on weapons and canned food.
The weapons and canned food thing is ridiculous. If shit actually goes down, a pistol and a can of baked beans will get you nowhere. But know-how will get you everything. Basic survival skills, something that would make you useful in a communal situation like carpentry or something along those lines would take you a ways.
Quote from: Variable on Sep 25, 2008, 08:19 AMAlso way past due to quit letting our elected officials do whatever they want with no accountability. Once you have the education, you have the power to recognize what is wrong and demand it gets changed.
Demand it gets changed? To who?
Quote from: Jerry_Curls on Sep 25, 2008, 08:22 AM
Since Dr. Ron Paul has been publicly backing Chuck Baldwin as of late, Chuck Baldwin wanted to make his thank you public...
Thank you, Dr. Ron Paul
by Chuck Baldwin
Yesterday, September 22, Congressman Ron Paul publicly gave me his endorsement for the office of President of the United States. In his blog at the Campaign for Liberty web site, he said, “I’m supporting Chuck Baldwin, the Constitution Party candidate.” (See the complete statement)
Obviously, I could not be more delighted and honored to have Dr. Paul’s endorsement. I called him last evening and thanked him personally. And now I want to thank him publicly.
I am fully aware that Dr. Paul was under considerable pressure from various groups that were actively soliciting his support. I can honestly say that I never lobbied Dr. Paul for his endorsement. He knew I would be thrilled to have it, but I have too much respect for Ron Paul to be so presumptuous as to expect him to endorse me. I completely understood his neutrality. He has strong ties to both the Libertarian and Constitution parties—not to mention the obvious fact that he is a ten-term Republican Congressman with much support from the Republican Party in his home district.
I was happy to support Ron Paul during the Republican primaries, because I believe in the same principles. I personally campaigned for him in several states and in this column. And I asked (or expected) nothing in return. In fact, I have stated this publicly, time and again: if Ron Paul had won the Republican nomination for President, I would not be running. I would still be supporting Ron Paul.
I am running for President because the Republican Party rejected Ron’s Paul’s message of constitutional government, fiscal responsibility, and non-interventionism. Therefore, someone had to pick up the mantle and carry this message into the general election. The Constitution Party asked me to be their standard-bearer in order to bring this message to the American people in November. So, here I am. And now, Ron Paul’s endorsement is further substantiation that the message of constitutional government will not die in 2008. The American people still have a real choice instead of the big-government, globalist, interventionist, “big box” party candidates, John McCain and Barack Obama.
Ron Paul’s message is my message; Ron Paul’s fight is my fight.
I want to return America to constitutional government. “The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.” (Amendment X) I believe that, and will govern the Executive branch of the federal government accordingly.
My sworn oath to the Tenth Amendment means I would dismantle the Patriot Act and restore law enforcement to the states and local governments, where it rightly belongs. Yes, this includes the so-called “war on drugs” and the so-called “war on terror.” No more warrantless searches and seizures. No more eavesdropping on Americans’ phone calls, or collecting Americans’ emails, or spying on American citizens without court order and oversight. No more stripping Americans of their constitutional rights in the name of “national security.” In addition, I would use every power and authority vested to my office to preserve and protect the right of the people to keep and bear arms. And, yes, I will immediately restore Posse Comitatus. As President, I want to protect America from Washington, D.C., as much I want to protect it from foreign powers.
I will also take the words of the Declaration of Independence seriously, where it states, “That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States.” This means the day I am sworn in as President of the United States, the New World Order comes crashing down! The NAFTA superhighway is dead. The North American Union is dead. I will work to eliminate NAFTA, CAFTA, GATT, and the WTO. The FTAA is DOA. I will not expend tax dollars for the support of the United Nations.
Furthermore, I will take my oath to the Constitution seriously, when it states that one of the express purposes of the federal government is to “repel Invasions.” This means we will secure America’s borders, because the illegal immigration crisis is more than mere immigration: it is an invasion, and I will stop it! Even if I have to send the U.S. Army to the borders, we will put a stop to this invasion of illegal aliens. I will also aggressively prosecute those employers who knowingly hire illegals. And did I mention that my first day in office is Border Patrol Agents Ramos and Compean’s last day in prison? I will personally open the prison doors and restore to these men their freedom. I will also give them their jobs back (with pay), if they want them. And one more item on this point: my first day of office is also U.S. Attorney Johnny Sutton’s last day on the job.
I also share Ron Paul’s concerns for the way the two major parties have allowed the United States to become a meddlesome, interventionist, nation-building empire for the sake of satisfying the greedy machinations of international bankers and power-hungry politicians. I will not only bring our troops home from Iraq and Afghanistan, but also from most of the other 130 nations that currently house U.S. forces. I will end foreign aid. I will get the U.S. out of NATO. It is past time for the European states to defend themselves. It is time for us to stop sticking our nose in every other nation’s business and start taking care of the United States. The Warfare State will kill us. Global empires are not sustainable. I repeat: global empires are not sustainable. If history teaches anything, it teaches that.
Furthermore, the Bush doctrine of pre-emptive war is over, when I become President. Because I will take my oath to the Constitution seriously, I would never send troops to invade and occupy a foreign country without a Declaration of War by Congress. In dealing with rogue terrorist organizations such as al Qaeda, I will seek letters of Marque and Reprisal from Congress, which would give me the authority to use whatever special and/or private forces are necessary to seek out and destroy those who desire our hurt.
And even though I am a born again Christian (as is Ron Paul), I would take my responsibility to protect the religious liberty of every American seriously. People have the right to worship God (or not worship God) according to the dictates of their own conscience. Whether one is Baptist, Catholic, Mormon, or agnostic, people have the right to practice their faith as they see fit. I am absolutely dedicated to preserving religious liberty. Religious tyranny is as evil as political or social tyranny. And, as I will be no man’s slave, neither will I be any man’s master.
I also share Ron Paul’s commitment to the sanctity of life. When I become President, I will use the bully pulpit of the White House to press Congress to pass Dr. Paul’s Sanctity of Life Act, which would overturn Roe v. Wade and end abortion-on-demand. On this topic, the GOP is especially hypocritical. The Republican Party controlled the entire federal government for six years and did nothing to save the life of a single unborn child. Saving unborn babies from the abortionists’ scalpel is more than rhetoric with me, however.
Another area of agreement with Ron Paul is my philosophy of economics. Dr. Paul has been predicting the current financial meltdown in this country for years. And when all is done, the current bailout being proposed will do more harm than good. The problem is, America’s leaders have rejected sound money policies for years, and the chickens are coming home to roost. As President, I would seek to overturn the 16th Amendment, eliminate the Internal Revenue Service, and disband the Federal Reserve. I would lead the charge to return America to sound money principles. I would seek to reduce federal spending to constitutional levels by eliminating those same federal departments that Newt Gingrich promised to eliminate in his Contract with America back in 1994 (and then failed to do). I would seek to eliminate the Departments of Education, Commerce, Energy, etc. I would demand that Congress pass a balanced budget and that we stop deficit spending. Neither John McCain nor Barack Obama will do any of the above. If he were President, Dr. Paul would do it, however, and so would I. Needless to say, I am both humbled and honored that Ron Paul would place enough faith in me that he would endorse me for President. I can think of no higher compliment to my candidacy. I here and now publicly thank him for this vote of confidence. I know my Vice Presidential running mate, Darrell Castle (a former Marine Corps officer and Vietnam veteran), joins me in inviting all of Dr. Paul’s supporters to help us take the message of constitutional government into the general election on November 4.
Thank you.
Posted by Cody Quirk in News, Letters, Campaign 2008, Ron Paul, Constitution Party, Presidential Race, Chuck Baldwin | 2 Comments »
Baldwin Thanks Paul, Affirms CP Platform
Posted by Brian Holtz --- September 24th, 2008
thank you very much for posting that
now that i read that i think i will vote after all
Quote from: Necrocetaceanbeastiality on Sep 26, 2008, 03:17 AM
Quote from: Variable on Sep 25, 2008, 08:19 AMI don't think its appropriate to enter a state of panic and start worrying about stocking up on weapons and canned food.
The weapons and canned food thing is ridiculous. If shit actually goes down, a pistol and a can of baked beans will get you nowhere. But know-how will get you everything. Basic survival skills, something that would make you useful in a communal situation like carpentry or something along those lines would take you a ways.
yeah , you missed my point bud. I meant that I don't think we are at the point of our society collapsing into anarchy or civil war. I doubt that the Military will actually be used. Its just the fact that they could is what is fucked up. But FYI, a gun and food would go a long ways in a survival situation. Just saying. Those are two things I would want.
Quote from: Necrocetaceanbeastiality on Sep 26, 2008, 03:17 AM
Demand it gets changed? To who?
Well you start a movement bud. If enough people know, enough people get worked up. You sign petitions, flood your state and federal representatives offices and phones with demands, have rallies ect ect ect. You let the politicians know that if they don't start to do things different, they wont get re-elected. Let them know that your eyes are opened and so is the majority of America, they cant pull their shit anymore. I mean, you do understand how democracy is supposed to work right? Make it work.
Only problem is that most Americans have no clue. They don't fucking care. Too busy living their charmed lives I guess. So right now, the word just needs to get out and people just need to start educating themselves.
Quote from: Oldnewtype on Sep 26, 2008, 03:27 PM
now that i read that i think i will vote after all
lol, who would have thought that we would be voting for the same person? I love how different we view so many different things. But a leader like Ron Paul can bring us together on the issues. Thats real leadership people, I dont think you will find that in Obama or McCain.
Quote from: Variable on Sep 26, 2008, 03:46 PM
Quote from: Necrocetaceanbeastiality on Sep 26, 2008, 03:17 AM
Quote from: Variable on Sep 25, 2008, 08:19 AMI don't think its appropriate to enter a state of panic and start worrying about stocking up on weapons and canned food.
The weapons and canned food thing is ridiculous. If shit actually goes down, a pistol and a can of baked beans will get you nowhere. But know-how will get you everything. Basic survival skills, something that would make you useful in a communal situation like carpentry or something along those lines would take you a ways.
yeah , you missed my point bud. I meant that I don't think we are at the point of our society collapsing into anarchy or civil war. I doubt that the Military will actually be used. Its just the fact that they could is what is fucked up. But FYI, a gun and food would go a long ways in a survival situation. Just saying. Those are two things I would want.
Okay, a gun I can see, but this whole stocking up on canned goods and bottled water thing is just so...pointless. You can't plant a can of tomato sauce in the can and grow a fucking tomato tree, therefore, it will be worthless in the kind of situation I see coming. (which, by the way, I will be completely screwed in, considering a full battery charge will only get me so far)
Yeah well I don't think we are anywhere near that kind of situation. We are at a cross roads of the US needing serious political reform. But not some sort of apocalyptic situation. The worst case scenario I could even see ( but doubt would / will happen ) is a 2nd American revolution. But if this gets to the point of violence, all of us failed really bad.
But just to entertain the conversation about survival in some sort of situation like I think you are talking about. No, you cant plant canned food. However, you also cant sit around and wait for all your crops to grow. You will need food right away. Food that wont go bad, until you can start to produce your own food. The MREs that we use in the military are great for such an occasion.
Bottled water makes a bit of sense too. If the tap water gets shut off. Where would you get your water from? For at least the first day or two you probably wouldnt have a source of water. Not clean potable water anyways. It would be wise to have a reserve for such a situation.
One of the most valuable lessons I learned from my experiences in Afghanistan. Control the variables that you can control. Go ahead and be prepared for whatever might come you way. Because you never know what will be coming your way. There are some things that no matter what you do, you cant control. But you can control and be ready for certain bumps in the road. So you might as well go ahead and be prepared.
I am rather afraid that Chuck Baldwin may be a John Birch Society supporter. Where I can't find any evidence that he is, I can't find any evidence that he isn't.
That worries me. I may not vote for him after all.
and what makes you suspect this?
Something my dad was talking about.
And exactly what do you have against the John Birch Society?
Quote from: Variable on Oct 05, 2008, 11:55 AM
And exactly what do you have against the John Birch Society?
Well I can say, that I just don't like people who have societies named after them...LOL.
I'm going to shut my damn mouth now because I have no idea what I'm talking about. I'm pretty sure I smoked weed with John Birch one time.
lol, o rlly? google John Birch and get back to me about that
Quote from: Variable on Jan 11, 2009, 05:43 AM
lol, o rlly? google John Birch and get back to me about that
Yeah...so apparently a different John Birch...LOL.
lol, yeah I think so.
The reason I asked hosh what he had against the John Birch Society is because I really don't know a whole hell of a lot about it. What I was able to find online was a bit ehhhhhhh. So, I was hoping for someone to be able to explain their purpose a bit better.
Quote from: Variable on Jan 11, 2009, 04:25 PM
lol, yeah I think so.
The reason I asked hosh what he had against the John Birch Society is because I really don't know a whole hell of a lot about it. What I was able to find online was a bit ehhhhhhh. So, I was hoping for someone to be able to explain their purpose a bit better.
Oh it's ok dear, you don't have to explain. I just like jumping into random conversations about things I don't know about and saying things that don't make any sense.
Um apparently the John Birch Society is about patriotism or something, or at least thats one of the words I spotted on the website.
Its been a while since I looked it up. But I remember it being something like fighting for the constitution, while trying to uphold conservative Christian morals. Im guessing hosh didnt like it because of the Christian morals. Which, I'm not really down for either. Because I don't believe in using government to force your religious beliefs on other people, regardless of if I agree or not.
But I could be totally off on that. I just saw that Chuck Baldwin and Ron Paul both had good things to say about it. So I figured that it cant be too uber horrible. But then again, that could be the skeleton in the closet that I have been fearing to find about Ron Paul.
for some reason, we are living in a time where Martial Law is being considered...?!
thats pretty scary.
http://www.wric.com/Global/story.asp?S=9655829&nav=menu28_2
Associated Press - January 12, 2009 7:45 AM ET
RICHMOND, Va. (AP) - About 2,200 Marines and sailors are conducting nearly two weeks of training around Virginia.
The Camp Lejeune, N.C.-based 22nd Marine Expeditionary Unit is training at Fort Pickett in Blackstone. But officials say they also will perform smaller group exercises at other locations.
Military officials say training in towns can give the unit experience dealing with urban areas.
Residents may see Marine vehicles on roads and aircraft from the Marine unit flying overhead and practicing setting down in previously cleared landing zones until Jan. 24.
The unit is preparing for a scheduled spring deployment overseas aboard several Navy amphibious ships. The Virginia work-up is part of a 26-week training program.
Information from: Richmond Times-Dispatch, http://www.timesdispatch.com
Copyright 2009 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
http://www.prurgent.com/2009-01-15/pressrelease27794.htm
The USMC is planning on taking over 424,000 acres of land, much of which is state or federal wilderness areas that are home to endangered and protected species.
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE / PRURGENT
29 Palms, Ca.- The USMC/ MCAGCC is planning on taking over 424,000 acres of land, much of which is state or federal wilderness areas, some of which is considered "Areas of Critical Environmental Concern". They are also going to displace thousands of people, virtually destroy the property values of several thousand other property owners, and negatively affect the quality of life of many thousands of local residents
. Above and beyond the above-mentioned issues is the despicable manner in which MCAGCC has handled the matter. MCAGCC has not only violated Federal and Constitutional law, they have violated the basic laws of common decency and honesty, and have shown blatant disregard for the local tax paying residents. They have not made any public announcement of their intentions, in violation of Federal law, and Constitutional amendments, nor have the local residents and property owners received any notification. Their motivations are obvious, to avoid property owners being able to adequately organize, and to prevent environmental protections organizations from getting involved.
These wilderness areas are home to the endangered Desert Tortoise, and Bighorn Sheep, as well as other rare desert plants and wildlife. This area will become aerial bombing ranges and a tactical maneuver - live fire area. In other words, total obliteration of these species. Not to mention the increased water, air, noise and dust pollution in the entire region.
The MCAGCC base is already the largest military base in the world, yet they want to almost double the size. Why? So they can conduct "three brigade simultaneous combined maneuvers". They consider these maneuvers more important than the lives of the local residents, plants and animals.
The MCAGCC Land Acquisition Proposal, by it's omissions, makes it painfully clear that they could care less about the devastating financial, and quality of life effects this take over will have on local residents and property owners. Who wants to be forced to sell their property when the property values are the lowest in years? Who wants to own property, or live in an area that has constant air traffic, 24 hour a day live fire maneuvers, constant aerial and artillery fire, excessive air, water, noise and dust pollution, (all of which are part of the proposal). Examination of the MCAGCC proposals verifies that there is not one single word acknowledging the proposals effects on area residents, and the manner in which they are handling the matter is quite insulting.
To date, the MCAGCC has failed to adequately respond to the community's complaints about over flights of military aircraft. The MCAGCC has already allowed too many over flights in Wonder Valley causing a disruption to wildlife and peace and quiet. Wonder Valley is already out of compliance with state air quality standards and any additional dust or other pollutants will only adversely impact the public health.
When developing the draft Environmental Impact Statement (EIS), the MCAGCC must recognize that in my view, the proposed expansion cannot be mitigated in terms of visual resources, safety, biological resources, air pollution, traffic, noise, or impact on our water and our quality of life. But must include the devastating financial and emotional impact on local residents and property owners, The costs of moving would be unaffordable and unfair, especially when property values have fallen so drastically, and I am very concerned about how the base expansion will even further affect my property values.
MCAGCC has said that they have held the initial NEPA "public" hearings, but these hearings were not publicized, and were not open question and answer meetings. The NEPA hearings deadline is Jan. 30, 2009.
Detailed information can be found at:
The official Marine Corps Land Acquisition Study (LAS) Website , http://www.29palms.usmc.mil/las/
Neighbors of the 29 Palms Marine Base expansion http://groups.google.com/group/desertneighbors?hl=en
Website: http://groups.google.com/group/desertneighbors?hl=en
More confirmations of this:
http://www.dmg.gov/climate/agenda.html
http://www.fbodaily.com/archive/2008/01-January/13-Jan-2008/FBO-01484404.htm
http://www.dmg.gov/documents/SUM_DMG_Meeting_EverlyC_061608.pdf
--------------------------
got this post from here
http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php/topic,80464.0/topicseen.html
Ok brother. You know I'm with you on most of these issues. Especially on this particular topic about martial law. But I think you have been fed some bad information. So let me see if I can present it in a different way that might be more accurate. I really have no reason to lie to you or try to manipulate you. Plus I think that you know me better than the person who wrote these articles. So hopefully you will take my word for this.
On the first issue about the 22 MEU conducting urban warfare training in Virginia. You have to understand that war has drastically changed since WW2 - Vietnam. The world population is growing. Thus the the amount of urban areas are growing. It is very unlikely that the United States will be fighting a traditional war in a rural environment any time soon. Therefore we must train to fight in Urban environments. Because training is everything. If you don't - can't properly train, you're fucked. Good training saves the lives of guys like me man. Trust me. The more realistic the training, the better you're chances of survival. So that is the purpose of the urban warfare training. I know that it is really easy to read that article and take away that the military is doing martial law drills. But I'm part of the Fleet Marine Force. Trust me, we are not training for anything like that.
Also. I'm not on the subject of the MCAGCC 29 palms yet. But coincidentally they are building a massive city on MCAGCC so that units can train within the training area of a base instead of real US cities. We actually already have a couple on this base. But none of those, or this new one, look anything like a US city. They are mock Iraq cities. We are training for urban warfare in the middle east bro, not the states. Plus the Marines are Americas shock troops. They are a highly aggressive force. Not an occupying force. To over simplify it. The Marines take land, the Army keeps it. So it wouldn't make sense for the Marines to be training for a mission like Martial Law. That would be the job of the Army.
Also We do all of our pre deployment training for Afghanistan in Hawthorne, Nevada. I had to drive through the city multiple times in military vehicles. A couple helicopters here and there. But its really no big deal.We just drive through traffic like anyone else. Or fly over like anyone else. Plus the people loved seeing us. A real small town with a lot of pride and respect for the military ( plus we brought money to spend in their stores).
That first article really isnt a big deal at all. Trust me. beides
The 2nd article as pretty inaccurate in my opinion. The Marine Corps has no Authority to cease land. They just presented a case for why they needed more land from Joshua Tree. And the local Government put it up to a vote. It wasn't some sneak attack like this article was making it sound. If its not obvious by now, I am stationed at the MCAGCC in 29 palms, CA. All the local news papers here and in Yucca valley had that shit on their front pages for a while. No one is stealing shit from anyone. And its not like residential property. Look at a map of the MCAGCC. It backs up to Joshua Tree. A National park. No one is getting their house stole or nothing.
They are right about the wild life though. But dam, trust me, we have to do all kind of shit to make sure we don't hurt any of those animals. It's seriously a pain in the ass. I know its for all the right reasons. But its not fun having to take all those extra steps when we are out in the field. Then the forest service ( or whoever is in charge of this kind of shit ) is always out inspecting and harassing us and shit. And if our shit is fucked up, they fine the shit out of us. Which is stupid as fuck. It just Tax dollars being transferred to one government agency to the other. anyways though
The training area of the MCAGCC is desolate as fuck. It is no where near a home for about a bigillion miles. Thats why marines love 29 palms. You can just roll out to the deserts and shoot in all directions without worrying about it. I really have no idea what these people are talking about. I mean, My house is in 29 palms and I have never hear a gun shot or artillery shell or military air craft. All that shit goes on MILES into the desert way away from the city. Not to mention that 29 palms isnt much of a city at all. The only reason this base is here, is because of the base. the closest Wal Mart and starbucks is about 40 min away. Think about that. Not to mention that a lot of these marines who are in charge and pushing for this expansion, are homeowners in 29 palms. I doubt they are trying to loser their own home values.
I'm telling you bro, you got some bad info this time.
Fasho.
lol after all that I get a "fasho"
Whats up with the original story we were talking about in here? Heard anything new on it?
Exclusive: Aides Map First 100 Hours
http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/us_world/Exclusive__Aides_map_first_100_hours.html
By MIKE ALLEN
Updated 2:45 PM EST, Sun, Jan 18, 2009
Officials say on Wednesday, which is being referred to as "Day 1," he is scheduled to meet with his economic team to discuss the latest calibration of his stimulus package.
From the campaign trail to inauguration, see photos of Barack Obama and his family as they head to the White House.
About 20 senior officials have had their paperwork cleared to enter the White House complex on Tuesday. Some will attend a traditional lunch with the new president in the Capitol, then get to work while the inaugural parade is under way.
The quick start on Tuesday is indicative of the months of planning that Obama's transition team has put into preparing for his opening days in office.
Officials say on Wednesday, which is being referred to as "Day 1," he is scheduled to meet with his economic team to discuss the latest calibration of his stimulus package, which is likely to be about $900 billion by the time it reaches his desk, probably in mid-February.
Obama will also meet Wednesday with his national security team to discuss "next steps in Iraq and Afghanistan," an aide said.
On the Middle East, "You'll see him act quickly," incoming senior adviser David Axelrod told John King on the debut edition of CNN's "State of the Union."
"The president- elect has said repeatedly that he intends to engage early and aggressively with diplomacy all over the world and using the men and women, the professionals who are in place, who are great, and, where appropriate, special envoys," Axelrod said.
Obama also plans a flurry of executive orders, including some on Wednesday. These orders are a way presidents can force change in government without having to go through Congress.
The early Obama orders are likely to range from the mundane to the profound – from routine bureaucratic proclamations about continuity of government, to a declaration calling to begin the closing of the U.S. military prison at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.
News stories have said the Guantanamo Bay executive order would come on Obama's first full day in office, but an aide said it might be a day or two later. Over his first several days in office, he plans a series of orders that will kick off his era of change.
Robert Gibbs, the incoming White House press secretary, suggested on "Fox News Sunday" that Obama plans early steps toward his top agenda item of tighter regulation of the financial sector.
"We have to do things differently, in a more transparent way," Gibbs said. "We have to get ourselves out of this mess, and only by demanding more of the financial institutions will we be able to do that."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
US prepares for continuity of government...[youtube=425,350]<object width="480" height="295"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/1xq0a2paXMA&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/1xq0a2paXMA&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="295"></embed></object>[/youtube]
Continuity of Government....secret plan[youtube=425,350]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/QdfjsS9Wqk8&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/QdfjsS9Wqk8&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/youtube]
hmmmmm
I just can't figure out how anyone could even be brainwashed into thinking this is a good idea. Not only that, but what the fuck do we have the FBI, FEMA, Coast Guard, local police and fire fighters for if we are just going to use the military for emergencies?
U.S. MILITARY PREPARING FOR DOMESTIC DISTURBANCES
Gen. Tommy Franks, said . . . if the U.S. is attacked with a weapon of
mass destruction, the Constitution will likely be discarded in favor of a
military form of government.
By: Jim Meyers
Newsmax
December 23, 2008
http://www.newsmax.com/headlines/military_domestic_use/2008/12/23/164765.html
A new report from the U.S. Army War College discusses the use of American
troops to quell civil unrest brought about by a worsening economic crisis.
The report from the War College¹s Strategic Studies Institute warns that the
U.S. military must prepare for a ³violent, strategic dislocation inside the
United States² that could be provoked by ³unforeseen economic collapse² or
³loss of functioning political and legal order.²
Entitled ³Known Unknowns: Unconventional ŒStrategic Shocks¹ in Defense
Strategy Development,² the report was produced by Nathan Freier, a recently
retired Army lieutenant colonel who is a professor at the college -- the
Army¹s main training institute for prospective senior officers.
He writes: ³To the extent events like this involve organized violence
against local, state, and national authorities and exceed the capacity of
the former two to restore public order and protect vulnerable populations,
DoD [Department of Defense] would be required to fill the gap.²
Freier continues: ³Widespread civil violence inside the United States would
force the defense establishment to reorient priorities in extremis to defend
basic domestic order Š An American government and defense establishment
lulled into complacency by a long-secure domestic order would be forced to
rapidly divest some or most external security commitments in order to
address rapidly expanding human insecurity at home.²
International Monetary Fund Managing Director Dominique Strauss-Kahn warned
last week of riots and unrest in global markets if the ongoing financial
crisis is not addressed and lower-income households are beset with credit
constraints and rising unemployment, the Phoenix Business Journal reported.
Sen. James Inhofe of Oklahoma and Rep. Brad Sherman of California disclosed
that Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson discussed a worst-case scenario as he
pushed the Wall Street bailout in September, and said that scenario might
even require a declaration of martial law.
The Army College report states: ³DoD might be forced by circumstances to put
its broad resources at the disposal of civil authorities to contain and
reverse violent threats to domestic tranquility. Under the most extreme
circumstances, this might include use of military force against hostile
groups inside the United States.
³Further, DoD would be, by necessity, an essential enabling hub for the
continuity of political authority in a multi-state or nationwide civil
conflict or disturbance.²
He concludes this section of the report by observing: ³DoD is already
challenged by stabilization abroad. Imagine the challenges associated with
doing so on a massive scale at home."
As Newsmax reported earlier, the Defense Department has made plans to deploy
20,000 troops nationwide by 2011 to help state and local officials respond
to emergencies.
The 130-year-old Posse Comitatus Act restricts the military¹s role in
domestic law enforcement. But a 1994 Defense Department Directive allows
military commanders to take emergency actions in domestic situations to save
lives, prevent suffering or mitigate great property damage, according to the
Business Journal.
And Gen. Tommy Franks, who led the U.S. military operations to liberate
Iraq, said in a 2003 interview that if the U.S. is attacked with a weapon of
mass destruction, the Constitution will likely be discarded in favor of a
military form of government.
That looks really interesting. And when I get back from work I will read and comment.
Quote from: Jerry_Curls on Jan 27, 2009, 01:41 AM
U.S. MILITARY PREPARING FOR DOMESTIC DISTURBANCES
Gen. Tommy Franks, said . . . if the U.S. is attacked with a weapon of
mass destruction, the Constitution will likely be discarded in favor of a
military form of government.
By: Jim Meyers
Newsmax
December 23, 2008
http://www.newsmax.com/headlines/military_domestic_use/2008/12/23/164765.html
A new report from the U.S. Army War College discusses the use of American
troops to quell civil unrest brought about by a worsening economic crisis.
The report from the War College¹s Strategic Studies Institute warns that the
U.S. military must prepare for a ³violent, strategic dislocation inside the
United States² that could be provoked by ³unforeseen economic collapse² or
³loss of functioning political and legal order.²
Entitled ³Known Unknowns: Unconventional ŒStrategic Shocks¹ in Defense
Strategy Development,² the report was produced by Nathan Freier, a recently
retired Army lieutenant colonel who is a professor at the college -- the
Army¹s main training institute for prospective senior officers.
He writes: ³To the extent events like this involve organized violence
against local, state, and national authorities and exceed the capacity of
the former two to restore public order and protect vulnerable populations,
DoD [Department of Defense] would be required to fill the gap.²
Freier continues: ³Widespread civil violence inside the United States would
force the defense establishment to reorient priorities in extremis to defend
basic domestic order Š An American government and defense establishment
lulled into complacency by a long-secure domestic order would be forced to
rapidly divest some or most external security commitments in order to
address rapidly expanding human insecurity at home.²
International Monetary Fund Managing Director Dominique Strauss-Kahn warned
last week of riots and unrest in global markets if the ongoing financial
crisis is not addressed and lower-income households are beset with credit
constraints and rising unemployment, the Phoenix Business Journal reported.
Sen. James Inhofe of Oklahoma and Rep. Brad Sherman of California disclosed
that Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson discussed a worst-case scenario as he
pushed the Wall Street bailout in September, and said that scenario might
even require a declaration of martial law.
The Army College report states: ³DoD might be forced by circumstances to put
its broad resources at the disposal of civil authorities to contain and
reverse violent threats to domestic tranquility. Under the most extreme
circumstances, this might include use of military force against hostile
groups inside the United States.
³Further, DoD would be, by necessity, an essential enabling hub for the
continuity of political authority in a multi-state or nationwide civil
conflict or disturbance.²
He concludes this section of the report by observing: ³DoD is already
challenged by stabilization abroad. Imagine the challenges associated with
doing so on a massive scale at home."
As Newsmax reported earlier, the Defense Department has made plans to deploy
20,000 troops nationwide by 2011 to help state and local officials respond
to emergencies.
The 130-year-old Posse Comitatus Act restricts the military¹s role in
domestic law enforcement. But a 1994 Defense Department Directive allows
military commanders to take emergency actions in domestic situations to save
lives, prevent suffering or mitigate great property damage, according to the
Business Journal.
And Gen. Tommy Franks, who led the U.S. military operations to liberate
Iraq, said in a 2003 interview that if the U.S. is attacked with a weapon of
mass destruction, the Constitution will likely be discarded in favor of a
military form of government.
I just feel like...if the US is attacked by a weapon of MASS destruction, there won't be too many people to govern in such a way...I would hope I'm not around.
wtf police state