JUSTICE HAS BEEN SERVED !
WASHINGTON – Osama bin Laden, the glowering mastermind behind the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks that murdered thousands of Americans, was killed in an operation led by the United States, President Barack Obama said Sunday.
"Justice has been done," said the president in a dramatic late-night announcement at the White House.
A small team of Americans killed bin Laden in a firefight Sunday at a compound in Pakistan, the president said, and took custody of his remains. Americaj officials said they were being handled in accordance with Islamic tradition.
A jubilant crowd gathered outside the White House as word spread of bin Laden's death after a global manhunt that lasted nearly a decade.
Former President George W. Bush, who was in office on the day of the attacks, issued a written statement hailing bin Laden's death as a momentous achievement. "The fight against terror goes on, but tonight America has sent an unmistakable message: No matter how long it takes, justice will be done," he said.
Obama said he ordered the operation after receiving undisclosed intelligence information. Senior administration officials said the terrorist mastermind was found inside a custom-built compound with two security gates. They said it appeared to hvae been constructed to harbor one high-value target and that for undisclosed reasons, officials became clear the hideout was bin Laden's.
Officials also said they believe the death puts al-Qaida on a path of decline that will be difficult to reverse, but there was no word on the whereabouts of bin Laden's second-in-command, Ayman al-Zawahri.
The stunning end to the world's most widely-watched manhunt came just months before the 10th anniversary of the Sept. 11 attacks on the World Trade Centers and Pentagon, orchestrated by bin Laden's al-Qaida organization, that killed more than 3,000 people.
Click image to see photos of bin Laden, reaction to death
AP/Manuel Balce Ceneta
The attacks a decade ago seemed to come out of nowhere, even though al-Qaida had previously damaged American targets overseas.
The terrorists hijacked planes, flew one of them into one of Manhattan's Twin Towers — and, moments later, into the other one. Both buildings collapsed, trapping thousands inside and claiming the lives of firefighters and others who had rushed to help them.
A third plane slammed into the Pentagon, defacing the symbol of America's military night. A fourth crashed in rural Pennsylvania after passengers overpowered the hijackers and forced the craft from the air — before it could hit its intended target in Washington.
The attacks set off a chain of events that led the United States into wars in Afghanistan, and then Iraq, and America's entire intelligence apparatus was overhauled to counter the threat of more terror attacks at home.
A senior administration official says Obama gave the final order for U.S. officials to go after bin Laden on Friday. The official added that a small team found their quarry hiding in a large home in an affluent suburb of Islamabad. The raid occurred in the early morning hours Sunday.
Administration officials offered some details of the operation.
Based on statements given by U.S. detainees, intelligence officials have known for years that bin Laden trusted one al-Qaida courier in particular and they believed he might be living with him in hiding. In November, intelligence officials found out where he was living, a huge fortified compound in an affluent suburb of Islamabad. It was surrounded by walls as high as 18 feet high, topped with barbed wire. There were two security gates and no phone or Internet running into the house.
Intelligence officials believed the $1 million home was custom-built to harbor a major terrorist. CIA experts analyzed whether it could be anyone else, but time and again, they decided it was almost certainly bin Laden.
Three adult males were also killed in Sunday's raid, including one of bin Laden's sons, whom officials did not name. One of bin Laden's sons, Hamza, is a senior member of al-Qaida.
Obama spoke with Bush and former President Bill Clinton Sunday night to inform them of the developments.
Obama struck a less than boastful tone in his brief announcement, although he said the death of bin Laden was "the most significant achievement to date in our nation's effort to defeat al-Qaida.
"His death does not mark the end of our effort. There's no doubt that al-Qaida will continue to pursue attacks against us. We must and we will remain vigilant," he added.
Moments after he spoke, American officials cautioned that the events could lead to heightened threats against the United States.
Officials said the U.S. would ensure that bin Laden's body was handled in accordance with Islamic tradition.
I swear, if any of you try to start talking about how Obama tried to take credit for the whole thing, I'm going to e-kick you. I'm getting enough of that nonsense on Facebook
but dude, he signed off on it.
Ha, Yeah I would hope so. Two helicopters of U.S. Navy SEALs flew into a country where we had NO authorization to use our military and killed a bunch of people. I certainly hope he signed off on it.
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 05:40 AM
Ha, Yeah I would hope so. Two helicopters of U.S. Navy SEALs flew into a country where we had NO authorization to use our military and killed a bunch of people. I certainly hope he signed off on it.
Lol got to love America.
at least we have this
(http://cdn.fd.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/bin-laden-dead-seagal-waterm1-600x382.jpg)
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 02, 2011, 05:43 AM
at least we have this
(http://cdn.fd.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/bin-laden-dead-seagal-waterm1-600x382.jpg)
Lol lucky us
Quote from: Frequency_Chemist on May 02, 2011, 05:42 AM
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 05:40 AM
Ha, Yeah I would hope so. Two helicopters of U.S. Navy SEALs flew into a country where we had NO authorization to use our military and killed a bunch of people. I certainly hope he signed off on it.
Lol got to love America.
Makes me want to watch team America.
Especially when I see people celebrating on ground zero
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 05:30 AM
I swear, if any of you try to start talking about how Obama tried to take credit for the whole thing, I'm going to e-kick you. I'm getting enough of that nonsense on Facebook
that was one of his election promises, wasn't it?
I don't think so. But that wasn't my point.
It's just that literally minutes after his speech people started making post like " Obama. Hahahahaha what a joke you are!!! "
and "What a way too take credit from Bush huh ! Sorry ass of a president you are Obama !"
and "well, I just listened to Obama's speech...evidentally he's taking credit for everything"
I literally pulled those off my facebook wall. That's not even all of them. I just can't take stupidity in too high of doses.
This is the only post I've seen about it on facebook.
"DEAR CONSERVATIVE REPUBLICANS / TEA PARTIERS / ETC:
I KNOW YOUR GUY TRIED FOR 8 YEARS.
NO WORRIES.
......OBAMA GOT HIM."
Of course it had to get turned into a Republican vs. Democrat thing. Of course.
Does anyone know what a false dichotomy is?
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:08 AM
I don't think so. But that wasn't my point.
It's just that literally minutes after his speech people started making post like " Obama. Hahahahaha what a joke you are!!! "
and "What a way too take credit from Bush huh ! Sorry ass of a president you are Obama !"
and "well, I just listened to Obama's speech...evidentally he's taking credit for everything"
I literally pulled those off my facebook wall. That's not even all of them. I just can't take stupidity in too high of doses.
it was one of his promises. he said that he was going to make it his top priority to find bin laden. he fulfilled that promise. he obviously was apart of it and he is the leader of america so i don't know what the bother is about.
i certainly don't credit bush for it.
Oooook? You and I agree on this. I don't know why you seem to be arguing with me about something that I agree with you on.
I just didn't really see "catching bin laden" as a campaign promise. But I guess it was.
I don't credit Bush either, that's my point. They are trying to credit Bush. I mean, really I don't credit Obama either. But neither was he. He simply said that he authorized the mission. Pretty much " the intelligence agency actually did a really good job, so I told them to go for it." He in no way tried to imply that he somehow should be given praise for this. He simply said that he authorized it. Which as I pointed out earlier, he kind of had to. So I don't see what all the damn fuss is about from my "republican" friends who somehow want to say Obama is taking credit for something he didn't deserve. It's just annoying.
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 06:18 AM
Quote from: Frequency_Chemist on May 02, 2011, 05:42 AM
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 05:40 AM
Ha, Yeah I would hope so. Two helicopters of U.S. Navy SEALs flew into a country where we had NO authorization to use our military and killed a bunch of people. I certainly hope he signed off on it.
Lol got to love America.
Makes me want to watch team America.
Especially when I see people celebrating on ground zero
Yeah I haven't seen that movie in forever. I use to have it on dvd, but I don't know wtf happened to it. It's just sad, but funny how ignorant we are. It's seriously pisses me off sometimes.America...fuck yeah!
YAY! We killed a bunch of people! Now lets go dance on the graves of a bunch of other people and somehow act like this is civilized!
i'm not arguing, trey. i'm just saying that getting bin laden was a promise that obama made and it got fulfilled. the thing is, bush said the same thing and he didn't accomplish it in his two terms. my father is crediting bush and bush alone, which is utter rubbish and makes me very mad.
in my eyes, america got bin laden. i'm not crediting one single person. i'm crediting whomever was involved in getting the arsehole.
Yeah it was a really big collaborative effort. I mean, I wouldn't really say that Bush didn't accomplish it. He laid the ground work and Obama continued the work and it eventually got done. Or should we be more accurate and say the Bush administration started it and the Obama administration finished it. Neither of the two men actually had anything to do with it.
If you REALLY want to get technical with it, Clinton started the hunt for Bin Laden. Tell that to your dad and see how he likes it.
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:40 AM
YAY! We killed a bunch of people! Now lets go dance on the graves of a bunch of other people and somehow act like this is civilized!
Exactly. Plus I like how in the above article the writer talks about how such a big blow the death of Bin Laden is to al-Qaida. Like theres not tons more people like him where he came from.
No body gives a shit about the death of Bin Laden. He was WAY out of the Al-Qaida loop a long time ago. And I'm getting sick of the news telling me (a service member) how happy I am that hes dead
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:50 AM
Yeah it was a really big collaborative effort. I mean, I wouldn't really say that Bush didn't accomplish it. He laid the ground work and Obama continued the work and it eventually got done. Or should we be more accurate and say the Bush administration started it and the Obama administration finished it. Neither of the two men actually had anything to do with it.
If you REALLY want to get technical with it, Clinton started the hunt for Bin Laden. Tell that to your dad and see how he likes it.
my dad hates the democrats. he calls them a bunch of sissies that don't get shit done. he was going on a rant a while ago that included clinton. something about a bombing of the u.s. embassy and clinton not doing shit.
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:52 AM
No body gives a shit about the death of Bin Laden. He was WAY out of the Al-Qaida loop a long time ago. And I'm getting sick of the news telling me (a service member) how happy I am that hes dead
I thought that's all the news was good for, hearding the sheep and feeding you propaganda bullshit.
Quote from: blixa on May 02, 2011, 07:53 AM
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:50 AM
Yeah it was a really big collaborative effort. I mean, I wouldn't really say that Bush didn't accomplish it. He laid the ground work and Obama continued the work and it eventually got done. Or should we be more accurate and say the Bush administration started it and the Obama administration finished it. Neither of the two men actually had anything to do with it.
If you REALLY want to get technical with it, Clinton started the hunt for Bin Laden. Tell that to your dad and see how he likes it.
my dad hates the democrats. he calls them a bunch of sissies that don't get shit done. he was going on a rant a while ago that included clinton. something about a bombing of the u.s. embassy and clinton not doing shit.
That and the USS Cole and the 1st world trade center bombings.
Quote from: Frequency_Chemist on May 02, 2011, 07:58 AM
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:52 AM
No body gives a shit about the death of Bin Laden. He was WAY out of the Al-Qaida loop a long time ago. And I'm getting sick of the news telling me (a service member) how happy I am that hes dead
I thought that's all the news was good for, hearding the sheep and feeding you propaganda bullshit.
Well it's annoying
66 years since Hitler was announced dead.
Well you know if some people in this country aren't told what to think they can't form they're own opinion.
or maybe people discredit americans a little too much. america has especially had a very volatile relationship with this man and now he's dead. i can understand if people don't have anything to say to that. they're happy, sure, but sometimes that's as far as it goes. the consequences of his death hasn't hit many people and that's fair enough, but sadly there's going to be consequences to this "justice".
There MAY be consequences.
I don't mean to be a dick. But I'm just not ready for mass hysteria and paranoia to spread all over the U.S. again.
i have a very strong feeling there will be a retaliation.
Be very wary about anything you recieve in the post, buy in a store or any air you breath America - there may be anthrax in there.
Quote from: blixa on May 02, 2011, 08:34 AM
i have a very strong feeling there will be a retaliation.
I posted this earlier on Kelly's facebook (devilinside) after a conversation broke about about this same subject and a guy pretty much called me stupid because I said " If they had the ability to attack us, they would have by now, it's as simple as that" Then Kelly kind of defended me a bit and said that I might just have a different perspective. It's late, I'm going to bed, and I don't feel the need to type it all again. So here goes.
"Oh I just read what these really smart PHD guys are saying. ;) Pretty much that we are so vulnerable in so many placers that if a terrorist was actually on U.S. Soil it wouldn't take any effort at all to get us. but that hasn't happened. So, it would be safe to assume that they don't have the resources to get over here. Think thats crazy?
what would it be to me to load a U-Haul up with a bomb, Timothy McVeigh style, and drive it into an elementary school? Then have my buddies sit outside all the exits with machine guns and blow the kids away as they run out of the building?
Not a whole lot TSA could do about that hu? Or poisoning the water supply? But that hasn't happened. Because it's a fact that you're more likely to drown in a bathtub than die of a terrorist attack (yes I can source that if anyone really needs me to)
so please, don't give into the fear mongering. Thats what happens right before the government takes advantage of us, again.
And remember, the real threat is your bathtub!"
I think it is also prudent to remember that these guys hated us, and vowed holy war against us, way before we swacked one of their figure heads. I think their hate level is just about the same as it was before we did this.
congrats for killing another man who has nothing about 9/11
keep go for justice, i wanna be the only muslim who left in the world
You're a wise man, i can tell.
no im just kidding
I want to see PICTURES! I don't believe it till i see it!
Quote from: Jerry_Curls on May 02, 2011, 08:01 AM
66 years since Hitler was announced dead.
coincidentally, also 8 years to the day that "Mission Accomplished" was declared.
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 02, 2011, 02:01 PM
Quote from: Jerry_Curls on May 02, 2011, 08:01 AM
66 years since Hitler was announced dead.
coincidentally, also 8 years to the day that "Mission Accomplished" was declared.
is that irony? i think it is considering the mission got accomplished. just not the mission bush was talking about.
just this time a mission really was accomplished
What mission got accomplished? Killing Bin Laden will no sooner end the war on Terror than us taking Baghdad ended the Iraq war ( don't forget that Bush was talking about Iraq, not Afghanistan or Bin Laden when he said that)
you guys are really amazing..
when they killed saddam they said ''victory'' and i coulnt count how many people die after that..
Terrorism..what a stupid word.
i dont have enough english to write the whole thing sorry but do you really think some people (1 billion people) says ''hey, lets kill usa people''
everything has a reason, did any fuckin body of you ask that ? (i know about you trey you could have know something)
go ask for the usa people ''what hell they want, why do they hate us?'' im sure %80 will say ''they attacked us, they kill their own people too''
why dont you guys dont talk about that
they say :
- usa and israel uses pressure aganist muslims, stop it.
- muslim countries goverments managed (controlled) by NOT MUSLIMS (thats why libya or egypt rebellion started)
- stop killing palestinian people and help us to use power aganist isreal to free palestine
- palestine is holding force by israel for 35 years..people dies and why you dont do anything about that?
- if you keep continue to kill muslims, then we will be aganist you on every aspect
- what do you do in middle east ? Go away
- let us live in our country as we let you live in your country
- dont come to war with us, cuz we are not in your country and dont wanna be in war with you
- dont become a part of our countries in goverments, we are not in yours..
- you want to be in war with us simply because patrol sources
- we didnt do that 911, its nothing about us
terrorism is the stupiest word in the dictionary
and you guys are thinkin like this is the same happiness of Hitler dead ?!.
are you retarded..he was a sick motherfucker but Ladin is just ONE GUY who thinks muslims are in pressure OF 1,5 BILLION muslims.
so you can say only two things :
1- all muslims are sick motherfuckers
2- the death of him means nothing to muslims, cuz they want something.
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 03:49 PM
What mission got accomplished? Killing Bin Laden will no sooner end the war on Terror than us taking Baghdad ended the Iraq war ( don't forget that Bush was talking about Iraq, not Afghanistan or Bin Laden when he said that)
Yeah I know, you're right. Bin Laden didn't have anything to do with Iraq. I just thought it was interesting that we found out about his death exactly 66 years after we found out about Hitler, and exactly 8 years after the Bush speech.
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:21 AM
Of course it had to get turned into a Republican vs. Democrat thing. Of course.
Does anyone know what a false dichotomy is?
I do now..
I would argue with the guy, but he always has like 20+ comments from people with the same views. So I move on.
Over the last 15 hours I've changed my mind. I do not believe he died recently if indeed at all.
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 04:47 PM
they say :
- usa and israel uses pressure aganist muslims, stop it.
- muslim countries goverments managed (controlled) by NOT MUSLIMS (thats why libya or egypt rebellion started)
- stop killing palestinian people and help us to use power aganist isreal to free palestine
- palestine is holding force by israel for 35 years..people dies and why you dont do anything about that?
- if you keep continue to kill muslims, then we will be aganist you on every aspect
- what do you do in middle east ? Go away
- let us live in our country as we let you live in your country
- dont come to war with us, cuz we are not in your country and dont wanna be in war with you
- dont become a part of our countries in goverments, we are not in yours..
- you want to be in war with us simply because patrol sources
who the hell are "they"?
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 04:47 PM
- we didnt do that 911, its nothing about us
who the hell are "us"?
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:40 AM
YAY! We killed a bunch of people! Now lets go dance on the graves of a bunch of other people and somehow act like this is civilized!
Your country can be pretty damn backwards when its happy :/
As always, rock n frost is mind-numbingly idiotic.
Quote from: Crazylegs on May 02, 2011, 06:20 PM
who the hell are "they"?
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 04:47 PM
- we didnt do that 911, its nothing about us
who the hell are "us"?
THEY = Muslim resistances
US = El Qaide
Quote from: theis on May 02, 2011, 06:28 PM
As always, rock n frost is mind-numbingly idiotic.
because?
couple updates.
Quote
The Obama administration has photographs of Osama bin Laden's dead body and officials are debating what to do with them and whether they should be released to the public, officials tell ABC News.
"There's no doubt it's him," says a US official who has seen the pictures and also reminds us that OBL was 6'4".
QuoteThe United States, after failing to find a country willing to take Bin Laden's remains, began preparations for a sea burial at 1:10 a.m. Eastern time on Monday, Reuters reported, citing an anonymous defense official.
According to Reuters, a defense official said the body was washed, covered in a white sheet and then placed in a weighted bag before "a military officer read prepared religious remarks which were translated into Arabic by a native speaker. After the words were complete, the body was placed on a prepared flat board, tipped up, whereupon the deceased's body eased into the sea."
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 06:36 PM
Quote from: Crazylegs on May 02, 2011, 06:20 PM
who the hell are "they"?
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 04:47 PM
- we didnt do that 911, its nothing about us
who the hell are "us"?
THEY = Muslim resistances
US = El Qaide
Are you saying you're in al qaeda?
He's Turkish man..
Let the adults speak, man...
And who the fuck is obama bind laden?
This made me LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9mzJhvC-8E&feature=player_embedded#at=93
Quote from: devilinside on May 02, 2011, 07:37 PM
This made me LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9mzJhvC-8E&feature=player_embedded#at=93
Donald Trump is not amused.
Quote from: devilinside on May 02, 2011, 07:37 PM
This made me LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9mzJhvC-8E&feature=player_embedded#at=93
He's a funny motherfucker.
(http://chzdailywhat.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/eca72b65-dba7-4a0f-8771-1c974e697e5a.jpg)
Quote from: BillyNo.9 on May 02, 2011, 06:21 PM
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:40 AM
YAY! We killed a bunch of people! Now lets go dance on the graves of a bunch of other people and somehow act like this is civilized!
Your country can be pretty damn backwards when its happy :/
I know you know he was being sarcastic.....right??
Quote from: theis on May 02, 2011, 07:49 PM
Quote from: devilinside on May 02, 2011, 07:37 PM
This made me LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9mzJhvC-8E&feature=player_embedded#at=93
He's a funny motherfucker.
(http://chzdailywhat.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/eca72b65-dba7-4a0f-8771-1c974e697e5a.jpg)
I saw that one earlier on Facebook. LOLZ!
You not gonna like that post?
Quote from: poofing acid on May 02, 2011, 07:12 PM
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 06:36 PM
Quote from: Crazylegs on May 02, 2011, 06:20 PM
who the hell are "they"?
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 04:47 PM
- we didnt do that 911, its nothing about us
who the hell are "us"?
THEY = Muslim resistances
US = El Qaide
Are you saying you're in al qaeda?
Am i saying that im in al qaeda ??
......jesus what brain..let me help you ''NO IM NOT''
your precious president says ''they are terrorist''
your precious president said ''we land on the moon''
everyone know who is trustable
keep coming to war..Palestine, Iraq, Iran, Kuwait....
as your mr president come and kill, they (muslims) will do the same thing.
Laden is nothing. He s the head of the 90s residence..
usa and israel attacked muslim countries and they answered, thats all
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 08:16 PM
Quote from: poofing acid on May 02, 2011, 07:12 PM
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 06:36 PM
Quote from: Crazylegs on May 02, 2011, 06:20 PM
who the hell are "they"?
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 04:47 PM
- we didnt do that 911, its nothing about us
who the hell are "us"?
THEY = Muslim resistances
US = El Qaide
Are you saying you're in al qaeda?
Am i saying that im in al qaeda ??
......jesus what brain..let me help you ''NO IM NOT''
your precious president says ''they are terrorist''
your precious president said ''we land on the moon''
everyone know who is trustable
keep coming to war..Palestine, Iraq, Iran, Kuwait....
as your mr president come and kill, they (muslims) will do the same thing.
Laden is nothing. He s the head of the 90s residence..
usa and israel attacked muslim countries and they answered, thats all
Wait...what?
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 08:16 PM
Quote from: poofing acid on May 02, 2011, 07:12 PM
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 06:36 PM
Quote from: Crazylegs on May 02, 2011, 06:20 PM
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 04:47 PM
- we didnt do that 911, its nothing about us
who the hell are "us"?
THEY = Muslim resistances
US = El Qaide
Are you saying you're in al qaeda?
Am i saying that im in al qaeda ??
......jesus what brain..let me help you ''NO IM NOT''
your precious president says ''they are terrorist''
So I assume by you saying "they are terrorist" you're referring to Muslims? If so,that does not apply to all Muslims,but you do have Muslim Extremist,which Bin Laden was.
"Common definitions of terrorism refer only to those violent acts which are intended to create fear (terror), are perpetrated for a religious, political or ideological goal, deliberately target or disregard the safety of non-combatants (civilians), and are committed by non-government agencies."
I do believe the actions of 9/11,that were under the authority of Bin Laden,would count as terrorism...hence why they declared a "Jihad" on Americans.
Quote from: theis on May 02, 2011, 07:49 PM
Quote from: devilinside on May 02, 2011, 07:37 PM
This made me LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9mzJhvC-8E&feature=player_embedded#at=93
He's a funny motherfucker.
(http://chzdailywhat.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/eca72b65-dba7-4a0f-8771-1c974e697e5a.jpg)
here's another one for ya
(http://i.imgur.com/1ZtvR.jpg)
As muslim i think i have to tell you ''Jihad'' means ''you HAVE TO fight back when they come to war''
- So I assume by you saying "they are terrorist" you're referring to Muslims?
Yes, because Obama or other USA presidents doesnt care about if anyone casual muslim or el qaide member.
You gotta heard about HAMAS, you call them as ''terrorist'' for years, but now %80 of the world says they are ''resistance organization of Palestine aganist Isreal'' and most of country welcomes them.
- If so,that does not apply to all Muslims,but you do have Muslim Extremist,which Bin Laden was.
Most muslim countries dont control by muslims. USA,UK,FRA came to Kuwait, Iraq, Egypt, Afghanistani Endonesia..etc
They have power in the deep state on these countries. They changed their lives, their TVs, their press..
So muslims who call hamas or other organizations as terrorist are hungry and poor and they have only CNN and MTV to watch.
- I do believe the actions of 9/11,that were under the authority of Bin Laden,would count as terrorism
If they did it you are right. They did so much things but not this.
Have you ever listen the different opinion about 911 ? (except that movie)
I did. I read, i searched, i listened so basicly all i can say about it :
USA economy needs Jewish money fathers as fuck.
That was a politic and economic idea between Usa and Jews.
Dude, its really different than what youve heard from the TV
I no able understand rocknfrost what he saying is.
Quote from: theis on May 02, 2011, 09:52 PM
I no able understand rocknfrost what he saying is.
here s the difference between us.
you said ''you are idiot'' 1 page ago.
and i asked you why..
if you were an idiot and even if i were sure about it, i wouldnt tell it anyone. Muslims do that, dont push yourself.
what did you mean about the Jews and USA man? That part mind fucked me a bit.
USA economy needs Jews.
Israel needs a ''body'' (USA)
Israel began to be a big HUMP to USA.
Usa started to refuse Israels wishes.
Basicly the global economy crisis, patrol prices and 9/11 are all made by jews.
This idea made so many people richer !
And gave one big reason to USA for going to middle east and call everyone that they kill as ''terrorist''. (the iraq war and evenatually iran and syria wars)
Usa stopped to be there for Israel right now..
Thats why Isreal decided CHINA to be their new BODY
So China is next to crash?
are the Jews also the reason we didn't land on the moon?
duh, and they caused the earthquake in Japan
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 02, 2011, 10:26 PM
are the Jews also the reason we didn't land on the moon?
nope it was an idea of your president who wants to make usa people believe they are better and more powerful than Russia.
next time you should be the next monkey on that ship.
Quote from: BillyNo.9 on May 02, 2011, 10:44 PM
duh, and they caused the earthquake in Japan
nope, shitz happens
tru dat
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 10:49 PM
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 02, 2011, 10:26 PM
are the Jews also the reason we didn't land on the moon?
nope it was an idea of your president who wants to make usa people believe they are better and more powerful than Russia.
next time you should be the next monkey on that ship.
That'd be pretty sweet. Oh educated one, what will be the next truth-bomb dropped on me? Are there aliens on the moon? Did JFK get killed by a time traveling Kim Jong-il? is Zombie Jesus real?
Who am i?
1- we are all aliens..
2- no but jfk was a good man
3- no but we know after the antichrist came to the world and acclaim that hes god , jesus will come and kill him.
here's the new bomb : the world statue is gonna change (elements) you may forget about electric in a few years
Quote from: downtownpony on May 02, 2011, 11:16 PM
Who am i?
ask to your mom
i know my father
jezzz, yu guys
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 09:43 PM
USA economy needs Jewish money fathers as fuck.
Haha one of the best lines I've read in awhile. I can just picture Serj from System of a Down babbling this in one of his songs
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 11:17 PM
1- we are all aliens..
2- no but jfk was a good man
3- no but we know after the antichrist came to the world and acclaim that hes god , jesus will come and kill him.
here's the new bomb : the world statue is gonna change (elements) you may forget about electric in a few years
You are high, arn't you
White House just released these details
http://tinyurl.com/3n5fzce
urm... funny?
Quote from: spitfire on May 03, 2011, 01:20 AM
White House just released these details
http://tinyurl.com/3n5fzce
They were born on the same day after all.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_10#Births (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_10#Births)
1940 for Chuck, 1957 for Osama.
Osama went to school with the guy from trigger happy TV
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 09:43 PM
As muslim i think i have to tell you ''Jihad'' means ''you HAVE TO fight back when they come to war''
- So I assume by you saying "they are terrorist" you're referring to Muslims?
Yes, because Obama or other USA presidents doesnt care about if anyone casual muslim or el qaide member.
You gotta heard about HAMAS, you call them as ''terrorist'' for years, but now %80 of the world says they are ''resistance organization of Palestine aganist Isreal'' and most of country welcomes them.
- If so,that does not apply to all Muslims,but you do have Muslim Extremist,which Bin Laden was.
Most muslim countries dont control by muslims. USA,UK,FRA came to Kuwait, Iraq, Egypt, Afghanistani Endonesia..etc
They have power in the deep state on these countries. They changed their lives, their TVs, their press..
So muslims who call hamas or other organizations as terrorist are hungry and poor and they have only CNN and MTV to watch.
- I do believe the actions of 9/11,that were under the authority of Bin Laden,would count as terrorism
If they did it you are right. They did so much things but not this.
Have you ever listen the different opinion about 911 ? (except that movie)
I did. I read, i searched, i listened so basicly all i can say about it :
USA economy needs Jewish money fathers as fuck.
That was a politic and economic idea between Usa and Jews.
Dude, its really different than what youve heard from the TV
I will respond to this later,don't have the time right now. But I will say, I know some things are completely different than seen on tv,but I did see the WTC towers hit,The Pentagon and saw images of the Pa crash. Now,the men that were piloting these planes were doing what Osama told them to do,and told them they would be rewarded in the afterlife. *something about virgins? I hope they were trannies instead* I also recall Osama calling a Jihad,a Holy War,on the US.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orawG7vt68o
And is your name by chance Ross?!?
Quote from: Livewire on May 03, 2011, 01:39 AM
1940 for Chuck, 1957 for Osama.
<3 the sig.
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 02, 2011, 11:06 PM
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 10:49 PM
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 02, 2011, 10:26 PM
are the Jews also the reason we didn't land on the moon?
nope it was an idea of your president who wants to make usa people believe they are better and more powerful than Russia.
next time you should be the next monkey on that ship.
That'd be pretty sweet. Oh educated one, what will be the next truth-bomb dropped on me? Are there aliens on the moon? Did JFK get killed by a time traveling Kim Jong-il? is Zombie Jesus real?
Uh, where have you been? Of course Zombie Jesus is real! Get with the program!
Jesus Christ guys. I leave you alone for ONE day and this is what happens?
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 09:43 PM
As muslim i think i have to tell you ''Jihad'' means ''you HAVE TO fight back when they come to war''
- So I assume by you saying "they are terrorist" you're referring to Muslims?
Yes, because Obama or other USA presidents doesnt care about if anyone casual muslim or el qaide member.
You gotta heard about HAMAS, you call them as ''terrorist'' for years, but now %80 of the world says they are ''resistance organization of Palestine aganist Isreal'' and most of country welcomes them.
- If so,that does not apply to all Muslims,but you do have Muslim Extremist,which Bin Laden was.
Most muslim countries dont control by muslims. USA,UK,FRA came to Kuwait, Iraq, Egypt, Afghanistani Endonesia..etc
They have power in the deep state on these countries. They changed their lives, their TVs, their press..
So muslims who call hamas or other organizations as terrorist are hungry and poor and they have only CNN and MTV to watch.
- I do believe the actions of 9/11,that were under the authority of Bin Laden,would count as terrorism
If they did it you are right. They did so much things but not this.
Have you ever listen the different opinion about 911 ? (except that movie)
I did. I read, i searched, i listened so basicly all i can say about it :
USA economy needs Jewish money fathers as fuck.
That was a politic and economic idea between Usa and Jews.
Dude, its really different than what youve heard from the TV
the conspiracy theories about 9/11 are complete bullshit. a lot of people believe it because we love conspiracies. just keep reading what kelly wrote. it'll make sense after a while because that's how shit went down.
when you have 'organisations' such as hamas and hezbollah who are religious extremists (lets not beat around the bush here!) and they infuse religion into their politics then damn it, the world is going to have a problem with it. bin laden did so much damage in the name of a religion which he didn't even seem to have understood. waleed aly wrote an awesome book called 'people like us'. everyone should read it.
and why are we talking about jews and israel? i'm so fucking confused as to why they are in here.
Im totally down with rocknfrost - the distinct memory I have of 9/11 (obviously other that the towers coming down), is an image from Afghanistan the day after on the news - the whole town was cock-a-hoop. It wasnt a 'woohoo loads of innocent people are dead' moment - it was a moment of 'Finally - some retribution for all the bullshit these bastards have been putting us through'. Terrorism is a bullshit word - its not like they have started the whole process to take over the world - its retaliation.
Quote from: lukas989 on May 03, 2011, 09:14 AM
Im totally down with rocknfrost - the distinct memory I have of 9/11 (obviously other that the towers coming down), is an image from Afghanistan the day after on the news - the whole town was cock-a-hoop. It wasnt a 'woohoo loads of innocent people are dead' moment - it was a moment of 'Finally - some retribution for all the bullshit these bastards have been putting us through'. Terrorism is a bullshit word - its not like they have started the whole process to take over the world - its retaliation.
so you're saying every action has a reaction?
terrorism is a word because it is alive in our society. call it whatever you want to call it, but it's there.
Yeah sure - its just the perception of it - as in 'theyre evil, we're not' - thats bollocks. The word in my mind suggests these rabid maniacs who love the killing and maiming and destruction...if theyre going to be labelled terrorists then the other side should be as well.
Quote from: lukas989 on May 03, 2011, 09:50 AM
Yeah sure - its just the perception of it - as in 'theyre evil, we're not' - thats bollocks. The word in my mind suggests these rabid maniacs who love the killing and maiming and destruction...if theyre going to be labelled terrorists then the other side should be as well.
"If you're not with us, you're against us?" hahaha
i think america has done a lot of questionable things but i cannot call it a terrorist nation. i think terrorism means something different to every nation as they will come to it with a bias. it's sort of like getting into a "it depends on what your definition of 'is' is" argument.
so you clearly think that america is a terrorist nation. what do you think should be done about it? what are your solutions?
Not specifically - thats like saying I think America enjoys killing and maiming and so on - I dont believe that (although its a given that on any side of a war, theres always going to be folk who do actually enjoy the craziness), Im just saying that the actions of America at times create the problems that eventually arise - theres no definite way of saying what will happen of course - just that if they thought that doing certain things in certain places wouldnt cause them to react in an extreme way they were fucking dense as fuck. So in other words they did expect it. They realise sacrifices have to be made to achieve what they want. And with America, the 'terrorists' use actions and tactics that are extremely hard to defend against or control. Sure be pissed off that stuff has happened, but realise the people doing it are not at the root cause.
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 02, 2011, 10:26 PM
are the Jews also the reason we didn't land on the moon?
(http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy20/from_musings/rocktinfoilhat.jpg)
- Now,the men that were piloting these planes were doing what Osama told them to do,and told them they would be rewarded in the afterlife. *something about virgins?
And you believe thats the reason why people in war aganist USA ?
You saw Iraq,Afghanistan, Syria,Endonesia...
These countries are so poor. Why ?
They have the biggest patrol zone on the earth. But people have no money.
They must be rich as Kuwait, Dubai..but they are not, why?
As Usa came to the action, they started to hate usa. NOT BECAUSE THEY WANT TO BE WITH VIRGINS
Dude, you are not better than them. They have brain, they can think, they have motions too..
Also they have moms,brothers, sisters which killed by usa powers.
They killed in their home, mosques..
What they can do aganist these action, give usa a rose?
They bomb the markets or whatever, because they can not reach their voices anyway.
Cuz once your press says ''Terrorist did this'' you believe them.
And they said thousand times ''We are not occupiers, you are..you are in our country''
No one heard.
I guess your Christian. If thats true you must be believing in heaven.
If you fight BACK aganist the powers who wants to kill you, if you die then you ll deserve the heaven. Whats the problem in here?
But suicide bombers is ABSOLUTELY forbidden in islam.
Anyways about why are we talking about Israel
Jews started to kill muslims and Usa supported it, thats why israil is in it
This is their flag :
(http://img1.loadtr.com/b-325110-israil39in_bayra%C4%9F%C4%B1n%C4%B1n_anlam%C4%B1.jpg)
that two lines mean the rivers.
- up line : ''the Euphrates river ''
- down line : ''Nile river''
The zone between this two river is belong to you says TORAH..
In 15. Bab, you can read.
So basicly they say these area is ours. You have to take this area till jesus come. Whoever you kill here, its a good deed.
Quote from: from_musings on May 03, 2011, 11:32 AM
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 02, 2011, 10:26 PM
are the Jews also the reason we didn't land on the moon?
(http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy20/from_musings/rocktinfoilhat.jpg)
ha ha aha ha ha aha ah ahahaa ! Awesome :D
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:40 AM
YAY! We killed a bunch of people! Now lets go dance on the graves of a bunch of other people and somehow act like this is civilized!
trey. ive got a lot of respect for you. you are one of the most educated people i hear opening and closing their mouth. i dont know you personally and i know we have argued some in the past, but i would trust you with my life.
i really can't voice on this too much. im pretty much out of the loop lately, and my ignorance of mainstream politics and media is ever-growing. but i will say, for some reason beyond my control, i am greatly saddened by this. i think that is why i quoted your comment trey. another human dies...
there's a good martin luther king quote about this, ill try to find it
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 03, 2011, 11:44 AM
- Now,the men that were piloting these planes were doing what Osama told them to do,and told them they would be rewarded in the afterlife. *something about virgins?
Dude, you are not better than them. They have brain, they can think, they have motions too..
I don't claim to be better than anyone,but I will say this. I am against war. Period. I am NOT a Christian,I do not believe in heaven or hell,but I do know right from wrong. And I do not believe I have heard of Americans hijacking planes with men,women and children on them and ramming them into establishments where thousands of innocent civilians are. So while I hear God (Allah) is a forgiving God and as long as your repent you will go to heaven,I don't believe these murderers could repent because they killed themselves. How can you repent the sin of taking all those lives,if you yourself are not alive? But I'm no religious expert so I could be off,but I believe they are burning in "Hell". I don't see Americans on American soil celebrating,shooting guns in the air if a country is hit with a catastrophe,no,we,most of the time,grieve for that country,try to be supportive and help. Islamic Taliban has killed possibly more of their own people than the US has. Yes, the America Military is guilty of killing innocent people,but more often than not,it's not intentional. American's don't go around strapped with c4 and blow up their own grocery stores. (unless they're a mental case) I think US soldiers should be pulled out and brought home,and let other countries fuck themselves up,kill each other,and not be able to blame the US for every damn thing. America is not a perfect country by far,but I believe in my heart,we try to do what is best and to try and help countries in bad situations (even if it's not always successful). I know America has helped rebuild many structures that have been destroyed (and not all by Americans),including schools. You can find many pictures of soldiers holding hands with Afghan children,and being kindhearted. Whilst American contractors,civilians and soldiers are beheaded by Muslim Extremists.
Quote from: wither-I on May 03, 2011, 02:05 PM
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:40 AM
YAY! We killed a bunch of people! Now lets go dance on the graves of a bunch of other people and somehow act like this is civilized!
trey. ive got a lot of respect for you. you are one of the most educated people i hear opening and closing their mouth. i dont know you personally and i know we have argued some in the past, but i would trust you with my life.
i really can't voice on this too much. im pretty much out of the loop lately, and my ignorance of mainstream politics and media is ever-growing. but i will say, for some reason beyond my control, i am greatly saddened by this. i think that is why i quoted your comment trey. another human dies...
there's a good martin luther king quote about this, ill try to find it
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that"
That said, I would make an exception in this case. Jon Stewart had some great points last night, I'm gonna try to find some video.
Better warn rock n frost that Jon Stewart is a jew.
We need to be completely reminded that "terrorism" still exists in our society today and of course the death of Bin Laden is a great reminder of that. Obama's ratings fell to the floor so this is great timing for him. I believe it's also a catalyst for something quite catastrophic will happen soon... Maybe to do with a power station and a nuclear situation. People here in the UK were arrested today near a power station under the terrorism act.
Quote from: BillyNo.9 on May 03, 2011, 03:02 PM
Better warn rock n frost that Jon Stewart is a jew.
ahh... i did not think of this, good call. oh well.
http://warmingglow.uproxx.com/2011/05/jon-stewart-killed-it
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 03, 2011, 02:44 PM
Quote from: wither-I on May 03, 2011, 02:05 PM
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:40 AM
YAY! We killed a bunch of people! Now lets go dance on the graves of a bunch of other people and somehow act like this is civilized!
trey. ive got a lot of respect for you. you are one of the most educated people i hear opening and closing their mouth. i dont know you personally and i know we have argued some in the past, but i would trust you with my life.
i really can't voice on this too much. im pretty much out of the loop lately, and my ignorance of mainstream politics and media is ever-growing. but i will say, for some reason beyond my control, i am greatly saddened by this. i think that is why i quoted your comment trey. another human dies...
there's a good martin luther king quote about this, ill try to find it
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that"
That said, I would make an exception in this case. Jon Stewart had some great points last night, I'm gonna try to find some video.
thanks man! its such a great quote coming from a great man with heart and mind. and a dick that he couldnt keep in his wife only...
Quote from: devilinside on May 03, 2011, 02:37 PM
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 03, 2011, 11:44 AM
- Now,the men that were piloting these planes were doing what Osama told them to do,and told them they would be rewarded in the afterlife. *something about virgins?
Dude, you are not better than them. They have brain, they can think, they have motions too..
I don't claim to be better than anyone,but I will say this. I am against war. Period. I am NOT a Christian,I do not believe in heaven or hell,but I do know right from wrong. And I do not believe I have heard of Americans hijacking planes with men,women and children on them and ramming them into establishments where thousands of innocent civilians are. So while I hear God (Allah) is a forgiving God and as long as your repent you will go to heaven,I don't believe these murderers could repent because they killed themselves. How can you repent the sin of taking all those lives,if you yourself are not alive? But I'm no religious expert so I could be off,but I believe they are burning in "Hell". I don't see Americans on American soil celebrating,shooting guns in the air if a country is hit with a catastrophe,no,we,most of the time,grieve for that country,try to be supportive and help. Islamic Taliban has killed possibly more of their own people than the US has. Yes, the America Military is guilty of killing innocent people,but more often than not,it's not intentional. American's don't go around strapped with c4 and blow up their own grocery stores. (unless they're a mental case) I think US soldiers should be pulled out and brought home,and let other countries fuck themselves up,kill each other,and not be able to blame the US for every damn thing. America is not a perfect country by far,but I believe in my heart,we try to do what is best and to try and help countries in bad situations (even if it's not always successful). I know America has helped rebuild many structures that have been destroyed (and not all by Americans),including schools. You can find many pictures of soldiers holding hands with Afghan children,and being kindhearted. Whilst American contractors,civilians and soldiers are beheaded by Muslim Extremists.
I wish everyone in here and in usa could be speakable like you..
Your points are true in one aspect.
Yeah, but theres another aspect why dont Usa n other countries see ? The problem starts here.
Just wanna give you a simple example :
You know Libyan people revolted aganist Gaddafi.
France air forces came and bomb the city and near 100 civillians dead.
If you go aganist Obama, and France come to your country bomb you and 100 people die, what Usa would do ?
In Usa aspect Libyan people revolts aganist Islamic pressure by Gaddafi.
Do you believe it?
For 35 years Palestine people, for 20 years iraq people were killed by anti-islamic forces.
Gaddafi and other muslim neightboard countries DIDNT DO ANYTHING.
Then ;
Libyan and Egypt people wants to take down them from the goverment just because they are not work for their Muslim people.
So Usa powers go on tv and say ''We are helping that poor people aganist Gaddafi''
Thats a lie, another classic lie of usa.
This is another reason to go into that countries, and become a bigger part of the state as they did in first kuwait and secondly iraq.
About suicide bombers.
Its clearly sin.
I would never support this way. But i can see why someone else can do ;
if 1 person give his life for saving thousands people, this is honorable.
So you are gonna say but that 1 person kills 10-20 civillians.
Yes because you are in war.
As you defend your warrior presidents and stay behind them, you are a part of war too.
Your planes killed 100 civillian and they killed your 10 civillian with bomb cause they have no planes.
American people should stop listen their lier presidents, i donno about Laden someone says he already dead in 2007, they waited for get more votes from people and there can be a reason that Usa soldiers leave Afghanistan, so they can economicly wins, people would trust the goverment more, and that would be a multiple victory.
Quote from: wither-I on May 03, 2011, 04:09 PM
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 03, 2011, 02:44 PM
Quote from: wither-I on May 03, 2011, 02:05 PM
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:40 AM
YAY! We killed a bunch of people! Now lets go dance on the graves of a bunch of other people and somehow act like this is civilized!
trey. ive got a lot of respect for you. you are one of the most educated people i hear opening and closing their mouth. i dont know you personally and i know we have argued some in the past, but i would trust you with my life.
i really can't voice on this too much. im pretty much out of the loop lately, and my ignorance of mainstream politics and media is ever-growing. but i will say, for some reason beyond my control, i am greatly saddened by this. i think that is why i quoted your comment trey. another human dies...
there's a good martin luther king quote about this, ill try to find it
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that"
That said, I would make an exception in this case. Jon Stewart had some great points last night, I'm gonna try to find some video.
thanks man! its such a great quote coming from a great man with heart and mind. and a dick that he couldnt keep in his wife only...
Yeah great quote.
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 03, 2011, 05:00 PM
American people should stop listen their lier presidents, i donno about Laden someone says he already dead in 2007, they waited for get more votes from people and there can be a reason that Usa soldiers leave Afghanistan, so they can economicly wins, people would trust the goverment more, and that would be a multiple victory.
What are you trying to say? That's a previous US president had him killed? Give me proof, a link, anything that says he was killed in 2007. Because apparently your media sources are legitimate, unlike the BBC or American media outlets.
thats the greatest sig ive ever seen. period.
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 03, 2011, 06:01 PM
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 03, 2011, 05:00 PM
American people should stop listen their lier presidents, i donno about Laden someone says he already dead in 2007, they waited for get more votes from people and there can be a reason that Usa soldiers leave Afghanistan, so they can economicly wins, people would trust the goverment more, and that would be a multiple victory.
What are you trying to say? That's a previous US president had him killed? Give me proof, a link, anything that says he was killed in 2007. Because apparently your media sources are legitimate, unlike the BBC or American media outlets.
dude, dont make me ''let me google for you''
also im not sure what is this but can help :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDTEEXG3ge8
Haha, what's the story behind your sig, Mark?
Quote from: theis on May 03, 2011, 07:18 PM
Haha, what's the story behind your sig, Mark?
Just thought it was funny and badass.
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 03, 2011, 07:16 PM
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 03, 2011, 06:01 PM
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 03, 2011, 05:00 PM
American people should stop listen their lier presidents, i donno about Laden someone says he already dead in 2007, they waited for get more votes from people and there can be a reason that Usa soldiers leave Afghanistan, so they can economicly wins, people would trust the goverment more, and that would be a multiple victory.
What are you trying to say? That's a previous US president had him killed? Give me proof, a link, anything that says he was killed in 2007. Because apparently your media sources are legitimate, unlike the BBC or American media outlets.
dude, dont make me ''let me google for you''
also im not sure what is this but can help :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDTEEXG3ge8
thanks for the video. You have to trust me when I say I want to believe(I want the X-Files poster) in this stuff. I love conspiracy theories. It's just that most are completely full of shit.
There's an interesting background with the story of Benazir Bhutto, with her relations with the UK and US. Check it out on wikipedia. From what I've gathered through the interwebs though, is that the video with her and Frost seems to be the source of the entire conspiracy. And there also seems to be a simple explanation with this video. The main information is at the 2:00 mark. Hope you don't mind the Jewish-sounding voiceover.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IIn_UnLO9I&feature=player_embedded
Quote from: bright lights, big city on May 03, 2011, 08:06 PM
Hope you don't mind the Jewish-sounding voiceover.
Of course not, im not Hitler.
But you are obviously American.
Dont kill me, dont hate me im not muslim i swear..
Well, ive just watched and live speech of Abdulbari Atwan who's an article on todays Guardian newspaper.
He basicly says the same thing. Anything can be happen, he may died before, they may catch him alive,we dont know cause they didnt show anything. Usa is untrustable. Thats what i know.
I would just like photos.
Here
http://cryptic-mysteries.blogspot.com/2011/05/osama-bin-laden-dead-but-conspiracy.html
that photo is fakeand has been around since 2007. Obviously photoshopped
http://img.ibtimes.com/www/data/images/full/2011/05/02/93874-osama-bin-ladens-widespread-death-photos-proved-not-true-pictures.jpg
I really don't have time to catch up with everything being said in this thread. I glanced it over really quick and just want to make a couple points.
These "extremest" that were killed the other night. I am sad that they died, the same way I was sad whenever I saw a dead Afghan. These are people. They are horribly brainwashed. Most of them didn't even know what happened on September 11th, they had no knowledge of this event. All they knew was that a foreign army was on their land fucking their shit up. So they fought us.
They are products of their environment, brainwashing, and bad Rhetoric. I can't hate them or be happy that they are dead when I know that they didn't know any better.
Also, the word "terrorist" is very ambiguous and interpretable. Thats why they use it. Anybody or anything can be labeled a terrorist, depending on the spin.
It's like Rome going to war to "spread civilization to the barbarians" What does "civilization" and "barbarians" really even mean? Looking back we know that was a crock of shit, but they had to convince their people to go to endless wars in order to create an empire.
In recent years we now go to war to spread "freedom" and "democracy" and to eliminate "terrorist". All of those words lack true meaning. Which is why they are used.
Has anyone else ever read the essay by George Orwell named "Politics and the English language?" if not, and you want to try to understand what I'm getting at a little better, I would HIGHLY recommend that you take 30 min out of your day to read it and try to understand what he is saying. here is a link http://mla.stanford.edu/Politics_&_English_language.pdf (http://mla.stanford.edu/Politics_&_English_language.pdf) It's only 9 pages
Quote from: Variable on May 04, 2011, 03:42 AM
I really don't have time to catch up with everything being said in this thread. I glanced it over really quick and just want to make a couple points.
These "extremest" that were killed the other night. I am sad that they died, the same way I was sad whenever I saw a dead Afghan. These are people. They are horribly brainwashed. Most of them didn't even know what happened on September 11th, they had no knowledge of this event. All they knew was that a foreign army was on their land fucking their shit up. So they fought us.
They are products of their environment, brainwashing, and bad Rhetoric. I can't hate them or be happy that they are dead when I know that they didn't know any better.
Also, the word "terrorist" is very ambiguous and interpretable. Thats why they use it. Anybody or anything can be labeled a terrorist, depending on the spin.
It's like Rome going to war to "spread civilization to the barbarians" What does "civilization" and "barbarians" really even mean? Looking back we know that was a crock of shit, but they had to convince their people to go to endless wars in order to create an empire.
In recent years we now go to war to spread "freedom" and "democracy" and to eliminate "terrorist". All of those words lack true meaning. Which is why they are used.
Has anyone else ever read the essay by George Orwell named "Politics and the English language?" if not, and you want to try to understand what I'm getting at a little better, I would HIGHLY recommend that you take 30 min out of your day to read it and try to understand what he is saying. here is a link http://mla.stanford.edu/Politics_&_English_language.pdf (http://mla.stanford.edu/Politics_&_English_language.pdf) It's only 9 pages
i remember in english class when everyone suddenly started talking about the mugabi regime and human rights came up and our lecturer was like, "but what is human rights?" and when everyone gave their definition of it, which was much the same but said differently, no one was able to give a concise answer as to why human rights were necessary in our society. it kind of feels like these things are a given, things like human rights. we should all have them yet most of us don't seem to understand what they mean. it's sort of trying to explain what 'being civilised' pertains to. what are civilised actions?
it's been some time since i read orwell's essay. i loved that piece he wrote on the lowly pub called 'the moon under water'. when he was writing at his best, orwell has never been surpassed. if you liked orwell's essay, then you should read flaubert's 'dictionary of accepted ideas':
http://www.scribd.com/doc/187244/Flaubert-Gustave-Dictionary-of-Accepted-Ideas-1954
man, i just had a brain wank.
Exactly. And we have had "human rights" defined by philosophers like Locke, but nobody has actually ever read John Locke's work. They just tack on these catch phrases that they believe have meaning, even though they don't know what they actually mean.
If I may be so bold as to give an example that happened to me today, and assume anybody gives a shit.
I was in an office today talking to two different friends. The subject about Obama and Osama came up. One friend (Dion) is a very good friend and I know he is a pro Obama supporter. The other (Chris) is really more of a work place acquittance and I don't know shit about his political beliefs. So this conversation happens, and suddenly Chris says
"Obama is a socialist"
I look at him, confused, and say "no he is not"
He responds with "yes he is"
I ask " do you even know what a socialist is?"
He thinks for a moment and says "no"
So I say "how can label somebody something, when you don't even know what it means?"
He says, " Don't disrespect my political party"
I say " I don't even know what political party you belong to. How can I disrespect it if I don't even know who you belong to?"
He says " I'm a republican, we believe in America and Freedom"
Once again, I ask "what does that even mean?"
Then I turn to Dion and say " see, these are pre-programed responses embedded in our brains. We say things, even though we don't even know what they mean. "socialist" "America" "Freedom", are words that most people don't even understand. America and Freedom really can't even be defined. But people ( I look at chris) use these catch phrases every day and pretend like they are saying something, even though they are saying nothing at all.
This is disturbing to me. This is not only acceptable behavior, it's the status-quo. The same concept applies to talking about terrorist and terrorism. You can't quite put your thumb down on any of it. But we act like we can, and we sure as shit go to war over it. People even get really righteous about it..............I don't know, jut doesn't feel right to me.
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/11/opinion/the-death-of-bin-ladenism.html?src=pm
?
Quote from: Variable on May 04, 2011, 05:37 AMOne friend (Dion) is a very good friend and I know he is a pro Obama supporter. The other (Chris) is really more of a work place acquittance and I don't know shit about his political beliefs. So this conversation happens, and suddenly Chris says
"Obama is a socialist"
I look at him, confused, and say "no he is not"
He responds with "yes he is"
I ask " do you even know what a socialist is?"
He thinks for a moment and says "no"
So I say "how can label somebody something, when you don't even know what it means?"
He says, " Don't disrespect my political party"
I say " I don't even know what political party you belong to. How can I disrespect it if I don't even know who you belong to?"
He says " I'm a republican, we believe in America and Freedom"
Once again, I ask "what does that even mean?"
I hope you LOL'ed in that guys face,I know I would have.
Yeah but I made him sound way dumber than he really did. In reality he sounded just like anybody on the news or in a normal conversation. I mean, I literally used his exact words. Just in the contex, he sounds ridiculous.
Imagine if someone questioned the validity of your every comment? And don't get me wrong, I am guilty of this too. But I'm trying to become more aware and de-program myself. Unplug from the matrix if you will.
has anyone ever read Simulacra and Simulation?
Quote from: blixa on May 04, 2011, 05:06 AM
Quote from: Variable on May 04, 2011, 03:42 AM
I really don't have time to catch up with everything being said in this thread. I glanced it over really quick and just want to make a couple points.
These "extremest" that were killed the other night. I am sad that they died, the same way I was sad whenever I saw a dead Afghan. These are people. They are horribly brainwashed. Most of them didn't even know what happened on September 11th, they had no knowledge of this event. All they knew was that a foreign army was on their land fucking their shit up. So they fought us.
They are products of their environment, brainwashing, and bad Rhetoric. I can't hate them or be happy that they are dead when I know that they didn't know any better.
Also, the word "terrorist" is very ambiguous and interpretable. Thats why they use it. Anybody or anything can be labeled a terrorist, depending on the spin.
It's like Rome going to war to "spread civilization to the barbarians" What does "civilization" and "barbarians" really even mean? Looking back we know that was a crock of shit, but they had to convince their people to go to endless wars in order to create an empire.
In recent years we now go to war to spread "freedom" and "democracy" and to eliminate "terrorist". All of those words lack true meaning. Which is why they are used.
Has anyone else ever read the essay by George Orwell named "Politics and the English language?" if not, and you want to try to understand what I'm getting at a little better, I would HIGHLY recommend that you take 30 min out of your day to read it and try to understand what he is saying. here is a link http://mla.stanford.edu/Politics_&_English_language.pdf (http://mla.stanford.edu/Politics_&_English_language.pdf) It's only 9 pages
i remember in english class when everyone suddenly started talking about the mugabi regime and human rights came up and our lecturer was like, "but what is human rights?" and when everyone gave their definition of it, which was much the same but said differently, no one was able to give a concise answer as to why human rights were necessary in our society. it kind of feels like these things are a given, things like human rights. we should all have them yet most of us don't seem to understand what they mean. it's sort of trying to explain what 'being civilised' pertains to. what are civilised actions?
What I think people believe human rights are, but don't really want to say it so they don't get chastised by their peers, is "that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain
unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." For someone to say that these rights are given to us by a creator/god is a touchy subject because they will come off as a Christian Fundamentalist. With me, it's the opposite. Even though I don't believe in a god, I still have the pleasure of knowing that I can express that fact and I still have these rights. It's amazing how in this country, ANYBODY can prosper, yet in some countries, one will never be able to achieve their dream because they were born into the "lower echelons" of society. Anyways, I might have rambled and not made any sense, I'm high ^_^
Quotehas anyone ever read Simulacra and Simulation?
I have totally seen Jean Baudrillard's name in the many topics I've read on other forums, but I've never dived into anything. I just might do it!
And to get back on topic...
Ignorant Public Cheers Bin Lladen Death Outside White HouseWeAreChange.org
May 2, 2011
WeAreChange journalist Luke Rudkowski hits the streets right after Obama's announcement in front of the White House on the front lines of the Infowar. The hysteria and planned propaganda have been masterfully executed by the Obama administration but watch Luke try to educate the erratic public about the truth behind Bin Laden. Luke also pleads with Geraldo Rivera to talk about WTC Building 7 (as he has in the past) in conjunction with reports about Bin Laden's death.
LINK TO VIDEO:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9FQv2TS3dY&feature=player_embedded
http://www.infowars.com/ignorant-public-cheers-bin-laden-death-outside-white-house/
Quote from: Variable on May 04, 2011, 06:47 AM
Yeah but I made him sound way dumber than he really did. In reality he sounded just like anybody on the news or in a normal conversation. I mean, I literally used his exact words. Just in the contex, he sounds ridiculous.
Imagine if someone questioned the validity of your every comment? And don't get me wrong, I am guilty of this too. But I'm trying to become more aware and de-program myself. Unplug from the matrix if you will.
has anyone ever read Simulacra and Simulation?
your mate gave such a republican response. it made me laugh. i've recently become very fixed on what i say. the last time i got semi-attacked was when i said that i would vote liberal if malcolm turnbull was leader and i got RIPPED TO SHREDS by all my greens voting friends. it was my most powerful moment because i was literally at my weakest and it made me drop the mumbo-jumbo of political talk and answer truthfully. my response was very simple. i like the guy, i like his policies, and he's not an arsehole.
i haven't read simulacra and simulation. i've read shitloads of walter benjamin though. i love the benj!
Quote from: blixa on May 03, 2011, 09:08 AM
Quote from: rock_n_frost on May 02, 2011, 09:43 PM
As muslim i think i have to tell you ''Jihad'' means ''you HAVE TO fight back when they come to war''
- So I assume by you saying "they are terrorist" you're referring to Muslims?
Yes, because Obama or other USA presidents doesnt care about if anyone casual muslim or el qaide member.
You gotta heard about HAMAS, you call them as ''terrorist'' for years, but now %80 of the world says they are ''resistance organization of Palestine aganist Isreal'' and most of country welcomes them.
- If so,that does not apply to all Muslims,but you do have Muslim Extremist,which Bin Laden was.
Most muslim countries dont control by muslims. USA,UK,FRA came to Kuwait, Iraq, Egypt, Afghanistani Endonesia..etc
They have power in the deep state on these countries. They changed their lives, their TVs, their press..
So muslims who call hamas or other organizations as terrorist are hungry and poor and they have only CNN and MTV to watch.
- I do believe the actions of 9/11,that were under the authority of Bin Laden,would count as terrorism
If they did it you are right. They did so much things but not this.
Have you ever listen the different opinion about 911 ? (except that movie)
I did. I read, i searched, i listened so basicly all i can say about it :
USA economy needs Jewish money fathers as fuck.
That was a politic and economic idea between Usa and Jews.
Dude, its really different than what youve heard from the TV
the conspiracy theories about 9/11 are complete bullshit. a lot of people believe it because we love conspiracies. just keep reading what kelly wrote. it'll make sense after a while because that's how shit went down.
when you have 'organisations' such as hamas and hezbollah who are religious extremists (lets not beat around the bush here!) and they infuse religion into their politics then damn it, the world is going to have a problem with it. bin laden did so much damage in the name of a religion which he didn't even seem to have understood. waleed aly wrote an awesome book called 'people like us'. everyone should read it.
I happen to be one of the MANY people who believe the truth of what happened on 9/11. Do you really think it's fun for people to believe that our government could do such an act? It kills me to think this, but I just can't believe the "official" story when there are so many facts that prove otherwise. The govt's actions, videos, collapse of WTC7, witness reports, just recent'y denying 9/11 first responders heathcare because they are being called "terrorists", the Project For A New American Century [ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sg_NRC8ozk ], etc. I'm reminded of this scene from
1984:
O'Brien's manner became less severe. He resettled his spectacles thoughtfully, and took a pace or two up and down. When he spoke his voice was gentle and patient. He had the air of a doctor, a teacher, even a priest, anxious to explain and persuade rather than to punish.
"I am taking trouble with you, Winston," he said, "because you are worth trouble. You know perfectly well what is the matter with you. You have known it for years, though you have fought against the knowledge. You are mentally deranged. You suffer from a defective memory. You are unable to remember real events and you persuade yourself that you remember other events which never happened. Fortunately it is curable. You have never cured yourself of it, because you did not choose to. There was a small effort of the will that you were not ready to make. Even now, I am well aware, you are clinging to your disease under the impression that it is a virtue. Now we will take an example. At this moment, which power is Oceania at war with?"
"When I was arrested, Oceania was at war with Eastasia."
"With Eastasia. Good. And Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia, has it not?"
Winston drew in his breath. He opened his mouth to speak and then did not speak. He could not take his eyes away from the dial.
"The truth, please, Winston.
Your truth. Tell me what you think you remember."
"I remember that until only a week before I was arrested, we were not at war with Eastasia at all. We were in alliance with them. The war was against Eurasia. That had lasted for four years. Before that --"
O'Brien stopped him with a movement of the hand.
"Another example," he said. "Some years ago you had a very serious delusion indeed. You believed that three men, three one-time Party members named Jones, Aaronson, and Rutherford--men who were executed for treachery and sabotage after making the fullest possible confession--were not guilty of the crimes they were charged with. You believed that you had seen unmistakable documentary evidence proving that their confessions were false. There was a certain photograph about which you had a hallucination. You believed that you had actually held it in your hands. It was a photograph something like this."
An oblong slip of newspaper had appeared between O'Brien's fingers. For perhaps five seconds it was within the angle of Winston's vision. It was a photograph, and there was no question of its identity. It was
the photograph. It was another copy of the photograph of Jones, Aaronson, and Rutherford at the party function in New York, which he had chanced upon eleven years ago and promptly destroyed. For only an instant it was before his eyes, then it was out of sight again. But he had seen it, unquestionably he had seen it!....
"It exists!" he cried.
"No," said O'Brien.
He stepped across the room. There was a memory hole in the opposite wall. O'Brien lifted the grating. Unseen, the frail slip of paper was whirling away on the current of warm air; it was vanishing in a flash of flame. O'Brien turned away from the wall.
"Ashes," he said. "Not even identifiable ashes. Dust. It does not exist. It never existed."
"But it did exist! It does exist! It exists in memory. I remember it. You remember it."
"I do not remember it," said O'Brien.
Winston's heart sank. That was doublethink. He had a feeling of deadly helplessness. If he could have been certain that O'Brien was lying, it would not have seemed to matter. But it was perfectly possible that O'Brien had really forgotten the photograph. And if so, then already he would have forgotten his denial of remembering it, and forgotten the act of forgetting. How could one be sure that it was simple trickery? Perhaps that lunatic dislocation in the mind could really happen: that was the thought that defeated him.
O'Brien was looking down at him speculatively. More than ever he had the air of a teacher taking pains with a wayward but promising child.
"There is a Party slogan dealing with the control of the past," he said. "Repeat it, if you please."
"'Who controls the past controls the future; who controls the present controls the past,'" repeated Winston obediently.
"'Who controls the present controls the past,'" said O'Brien, nodding his head with slow approval. "Is it your opinion, Winston, that the past has real existence?"
Again the feeling of helplessness descended upon Winston. His eyes flitted towards the dial. He not only did not know whether "yes" or "no" was the answer that would save him from pain; he did not even know which answer he believed to be the true one.
O'Brien smiled faintly. "You are no metaphysician, Winston," he said. "Until this moment you had never considered what is meant by existence. I will put it more precisely. Does the past exist concretely, in space? Is there somewhere or other a place, a world of solid objects, where the past is still happening?"
"No."
"Then where does the past exist, if at all?"
"In records. It is written down."
"In records. And --?"
"In the mind. In human memories."
"In memory. Very well, then. We, the Party, control all records, and we control all memories. Then we control the past, do we not?"
"But how can you stop people remembering things?" cried Winston again momentarily forgetting the dial. "It is involuntary. It is outside oneself. How can you control memory? You have not controlled mine!"
O'Brien's manner grew stern again. He laid his hand on the dial.
"On the contrary," he said, "
you have not controlled it. That is what has brought you here. You are here because you have failed in humility, in self-discipline. You would not make the act of submission which is the price of sanity. You preferred to be a lunatic, a minority of one. Only the disciplined mind can see reality, Winston. You believe that reality is something objective, external, existing in its own right. You also believe that the nature of reality is self-evident. When you delude yourself into thinking that you see something, you assume that everyone else sees the same thing as you. But I tell you, Winston, that reality is not external. Reality exists in the human mind, and nowhere else. Not in the individual mind, which can make mistakes, and in any case soon perishes; only in the mind of the Party, which is collective and immortal. Whatever the Party holds to be the truth is truth. It is impossible to see reality except by looking through the eyes of the Party. That is the fact that you have got to relearn, Winston. It needs an act of self-destruction, an effort of the will. You must humble yourself before you can become sane."
-- George Orwell,
Nineteen Eighty-Four, pp. 202-06
http://www.george-orwell.org/1984/index.html
misinformation is the most powerful weapon in the universe.
i'm on the mailing list of rev graham long, who is a pastor at the wayside chapel in kings cross. i love his emails because he's so funny and smart:
Dear Inner Circle,
Walking in this morning there was rubbish all around our front door. It was not a good look. A quick glance revealed the problem, this week of all weeks. I saw our Bin Laden.
/lollercoaster.
and yeah by the way orwell is awesome, our band was originally called 1984. We have a few songs based on alot of his stuff.
Haha, talk about some bullshit.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/04/osama-bin-laden-pictures_n_857568.html
WASHINGTON -- President Barack Obama will not release photos of Osama bin Laden's dead body as proof that he was killed, White House Press Secretary Jay Carney said in a Wednesday briefing.
Carney read from a transcript of a presidential interview with CBS' "60 Minutes" set to air Sunday. In the interview, Obama says he discussed the issue with Defense Secretary Robert Gates, Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton and intelligence teams and they all agreed it was best not to release the images.
"It is important to make sure that very graphic photos of somebody who was shot in the head are not floating around as an incitement to additional violence or as a propaganda tool," the president said in the interview.
"We don't need to spike the football and I think that given the graphic nature of these photos, it would create some national security risk," he said. "We don't trot out this stuff as trophies."
Obama said there is "certainly" no doubt among al Qaeda members that bin Laden is dead so "we don't think a photograph in and of itself is going to make any difference."
"The fact of the matter is, you will not see bin Laden walking on this earth again," he added
Top U.S. intelligence officials have been increasingly divided over the benefits of releasing photos as proof that the al Qaeda leader was killed Sunday during a U.S. raid on his compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan.
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House Intelligence Chairman Mike Rogers (R-Mich.) announced Wednesday that he opposed the photos' release because the action could complicate matters for U.S. troops serving in Iraq and Afghanistan.
"The risks of release outweigh the benefits," Rogers said in a statement. "Conspiracy theorists around the world will just claim the photos are doctored anyway."
He questioned how Americans would react if al Qaeda killed a top U.S. military leader and released photos of the body on the Internet. "Osama bin Laden is not a trophy," he said. "He is dead and let's now focus on continuing the fight until Al Qaida has been eliminated."
Senate Intelligence Chair Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) has also said that she sees no need to release photos since other evidence has already proven that bin Laden is dead.
"The DNA has been dispositive," she said.
But Senate Homeland Security Chairman Joe Lieberman (I-Conn.) and the panel's top Republican, Sen. Susan Collins (Maine), said during a Monday press briefing that it "may be necessary" to release photos to prove to the public once and for all that bin Laden is dead.
"My own instinct is it's necessary to release those pictures," Lieberman said, "but I will respect whatever decision the president makes."
In stark contrast to Obama's final decision, CIA Director Leon Panetta declared Tuesday during an interview on "NBC Nightly News" that there was never "any question that ultimately a photograph would be presented to the public."
"The bottom line is, you know, we got bin Laden and I think we have to reveal to the rest of the world that we were able to get him and kill him," Panetta said.
Carney declined to weigh in on Panetta's comments, saying only that the president made his decision Wednesday morning.
At the Wednesday briefing, Carney also insisted that the manner in which bin Laden was killed was carried out lawfully. The fact that bin Laden wasn't armed when he was killed has raised questions about whether U.S. military operatives had any intention of capturing him alive -- which intelligence officials have said was an option.
The team of Navy SEALs had the authority to kill bin Laden if their safety was at risk, Carney said, and the raid was conducted in a manner fully consistent with the laws of war. "There is simply no question that this mission was lawful.... We acted in the nation's self-defense," he said.
Carney wouldn't give any details about whether others on the compound were firing at them or how bin Laden resisted arrest.
"We've gotten to the point where we cannot cross lines" by giving more details on the operation, he said. "We've revealed a lot of information and been as forthcoming with facts we can be. ... We've gone to the limit of our ability to do that and still maintain some of the things we need to maintain and be kept secret."
Carney also left open the possibility that enhanced interrogation techniques may have been used to compel al Qaeda operatives to give information about bin Laden's whereabouts.
"I can't categorically rule out" that such techniques may have been used at some point in the process of tracking down bin Laden, he said.
This article has been updated to include the press secretary's comments about President Obama's "60 Minutes" interview.
"We don't trot out this stuff as trophies."
Yeah, right. An American saying that ? Come on.
maybe america is trying to change. that was obama's slogan. i think it's a good idea to not release any photos. there were photos of tupac after he died yet there are still people who believe he's alive. just sayin'...
i still want photos. but i can see why they wouldn't be released. you know everyone here would go all crazy because it would show gore and blood and OH DEAR GOD
(http://10cities10years.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/think_of_the_children.jpg)
/goes and plays some violent video games.
Quote from: blixa on May 05, 2011, 01:07 PM
maybe america is trying to change. that was obama's slogan. i think it's a good idea to not release any photos. there were photos of tupac after he died yet there are still people who believe he's alive. just sayin'...
America is not trying to change. Especially if Zbigniew Brzezinski and his puppet, Obama, are alive. He has been quoted, telling Afghan Jihadists in the late 70's "Your cause is right. God is on your side."
(http://polytricks.files.wordpress.com/2008/09/brzezinskisplash.jpg)
Ex-Security Chief Brzezinski's Interview makes clear:
The Muslim Terrorist Apparatus was Created by US Intelligence as a Geopolitical WeaponLe Nouvel Observateur's Interview with Zbigniew Brzezinski, President Jimmy Carter's National Security Adviser Published 15-21 January 1998 Translated by Jean Martineau
I. Comment: The US & European States are still using Brzezinski's Muslim terrorist strategy! by Jared Israel
II. Interview with Brzezinski [Posted 6 September 2004]
=======================================
Below is our translation of an interview with Zbigniew Brzezinski. It is important for three reasons. First, it flatly contradicts the official US justification for giving billions of dollars to the mujahideen in Afghanistan in the 1980s, namely that the US and Saudi Arabia were defending so-called freedom fighters against Soviet aggression. Not so, says Brzezinski. He confirms what opponents have charged: that the US began covert sponsorship of Muslim extremists five months *before* the Soviets invaded Afghanistan. He says that after President Carter authorized the covert action:
"I explained to the president that this support would in my opinion lead to a military intervention by the Soviets."
Second, the interview is instructive concerning so-called "conspiracy theory." To be sure, there are plenty of nutty theories out there. And of course, there are plenty of just plain wrong theories. But as Brzezinski demonstrates, the US foreign policy establishment did, for want of a better word, conspire. Even as they claimed to oppose Muslim extremism, they knowingly fomented it *as a weapon of policy.* And they lied about what they were doing, pretending they were helping freedom fighters resist an invasion. In other words, deceit on two levels. One must ask oneself: if the US foreign policy Establishment used Muslim extremism as a weapon once, how can one argue *in principle* that they would not use it again? We say they *have* used it again; that they have used it continuously; and that we are seeing the fruits of this policy. Most recently we have seen the real essence of the Brzezinski doctrine in the horrendous events this past week in Russia (culminating in the school attack) and Israel (the double bus bombing).
========================================================
Lying with dollars
========================================================
Brzezinski and his protégé, Zalmay Khalilzad, set up a corporation in 1985, funded by the US congress, to train the mujahideen to sell reporters the lie that the mujahideen were freedom fighters and victims of aggression:
U.S. Provides $500,000 So Afghan Rebels Can Tell Their Story
AP, September 16, 1985, Monday, PM cycle SECTION: Washington Dateline By JOAN MOWER WASHINGTON
Guerrillas in Afghanistan are about to get money from the United States government for a public relations campaign intended to bring their struggle against Soviet troops to the world's attention. The money will train Afghan rebel journalists to use television, radio and newspapers to advance their cause. Reporters will be given mini-cameras to photograph the war inside Afghanistan. "It is the goal of this project to facilitate the collection, development and distribution of credible, objective and timely professional-quality news stories, photographs and television images about developments in Afghanistan," said a notice in the Federal Register. The program will be overseen by Uncle Sam's own propaganda arm, the U.S. Information Agency. Congress appropriated $500,000 to hire experts and may provide more later.
In making the money available, Congress all but instructed USIA to consider an organization like Friends of Afghanistan, a new group whose board includes former Carter administration national security adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski, known for hard-line anti-Soviet views. USIA has solicited proposals, due Sept. 25. Friends of Afghanistan includes other American foreign policy luminaries such as Lawrence Eagleburger, a former undersecretary of state, and Dr. Zalmay Khalilzad, a Columbia University political science professor and some-time paid adviser to the State Department on Afghanistan.
[Note from Jared Israel - Eagleburger played a prominent role in first Bush administration in demonizing the Bosnian Serbs.]
[...]
Afghan rebels, called the Mujahadeen, have been battling 100,000 Soviet troops who have occupied the rugged, mountainous country since December 1979.
[...]
[Excerpt from Associated Press dispatch ends here]
The Associated Press referred to Khalilzad as a "some-time paid adviser to the State Department on Afghanistan." This was in the late summer of 1985. Less than three years later Tass, the Soviet news agency, reported that Khalilzad was delivering the mujahideen an important message from the State Department. Khalilzad told them that the State Department would continue to support them a) only if they could consolidate control of Afghanistan and b) only if they maintained an attitude of implacable hostility to the government in Kabul. In other words the US ordered the mujahideen *not* to make peace:
"'The United States has told the Afghan guerrillas that it would support them in an effort to form a provisional government if they consolidate their control of most of the country and meet other criteria,' the newspaper New York Times today quoted State Department officials as saying. A top State Department official made it clear that the government must oppose 'the soviet-backed regime in Kabul' and said that the USA did not 'accept the legitimacy' of the authorities in Afghanistan. The relevant message was delivered to the rebels in the Pakistani city of Peshawar last week by Zalmay Khalilzad, a special adviser on Afghanistan to under secretary of state Michael H. Armacost..."
[-- To Support Afghan Counter Revolutionaries New York; The Russian Information Agency ITAR-TASS, May 6, 1988, Friday]
========================================================
Applying the techniques developed in Afghanistan to Bosnia
========================================================
Brzezinski's interview has tremendous importance today. According to a Dutch intelligence report on Bosnia, in the early 1990s Pentagon intelligence worked with the Saudis and Iranians to bring weapons and mujahideen terrorists - the 'Afghan Arabs' - into Bosnia to indoctrinate and lead Alija Izetbegovic's Muslim extremists in fighting the Bosnian Serbs. [1] The same terrorists had been used against the pro-Soviet side in Afghanistan. Once again the media lied, claiming the Bosnian Serbs were fighting to destroy the Bosnian Muslims (i.e., genocide) when they were in fact defending their communities from the mujahideen, and were allied with a large group of moderate Muslims. [2] This picture appeared in the London Times on December 11, 1995. The caption reads: "One of the Bosnian Army's Muslim brigades marches through Zenica in a demonstration of strength by 10,000 soldiers." Note that according to the Times these 10,000 troops constituted only *one* of "the Bosnian Army's Muslim brigades..."
During the 1990s, pictures like this were as rare as hen's teeth in the Western media. Why? Because they graphically demonstrated that the media was lying when it claimed that the "Bosnian Government" was moderate and multiculturalist and so on. The white costumes these troops are wearing are the uniforms of Middle Eastern mujahideen, not Yugoslav Muslims. The Bosnian Muslim troops wore them because they had been indoctrinated by Muslim extremists, including mujahideen imported by Iran, Saudi Arabia and other extremist states, with the participation of Pentagon intelligence. In the early part of the Bosnian conflict (up until January 1993) Zalmay Khalilzad, the protégé of Zginew Brzezinski, was in charge of strategic planning at the Pentagon. [3]
In Afghanistan (as Brzezinski proudly states) and then in Bosnia, the US sponsored Muslim terror even as the State Department was officially condemning it. Because ordinary people would never support such a policy, it was sold to the public as support for freedom fighters (Afghanistan) or as defense of abused Muslims (Bosnia.) By the late 1980s Brzezinski's protégé, Prof. Zalmay Khalilzad, was the top strategist of the Afghan war. Under the administration of Bush, Sr., Khalilzad was in charge of strategy at the Pentagon. We have substantial evidence that it was under Bush, Sr., not Clinton, that the US began assisting the mujahideen in Bosnia. So, in both cases, we have Brzezinski's protégé directing the use of Muslim extremism as a weapon against a secular state, with the media misrepresenting the nature of the fight. The Brzezinski Doctrine in action.
========================================================
2001: Brzezinski's protégé Zalmay Khalilzad was appointed Senior National Security Director for Southwest Asia, the heartland of Muslim extremist terror...
========================================================
Want some food for thought? From May 23, 2001 until November 27, 2003, Prof. Khalilzad was "Special Assistant to the President and Senior Director for Gulf, Southwest Asia and Other Regional Issues, National Security Council." Southwest Asia covers the area from Pakistan to Saudi Arabia, including Iraq and Iran; it includes most of the Middle East and extends to Georgia. See White House map at
http://www.politicsol.com/terrorism/maps.html
* Khalilzad was in charge of US policy on the ground in Afghanistan before and during the 2001 war. He then personally chose the Afghan government. It was under his watch that the US and Iran cooperated in convening a top level conference to give Afghanistan a government based on Muslim religious law. Now he's Ambassador and Special Envoy to Afghanistan. [4]
* Even while Khalilzad was in charge of Afghanistan he was also the key man on the ground before, during and after the invasion of Iraq. He was in charge of political relations with Iraqi exile politicians and the Iranian and Saudi governments up until the fall 2003. A crucial period.
* His area of official responsibility included Georgia during the period when the US was intensifying the financing and training of the Georgian military. Russia accuses Georgia of aiding the Chechen terrorists.
So Brzezinski has been the key hands-on strategist, the leader on the ground, in a vast area plagued with Muslim extremist terror during most of the so-called war on terror. Oops - did I say Brzezinski? Sorry; I meant Zalmay Khalilzad...
Regarding US-Iranian cooperation to use Muslim extremist terror in Bosnia, see "How the U.S. & Iran have Cooperated to Sponsor Muslim Terror," at http://emperors-clothes.com/analysis/deja.htm
Also see 'Articles Documenting U.S. Creation of Taliban and bin Laden's Terrorist Network' at http://emperors-clothes.com/docs/doc.htm
Regarding Brzezinski's protégé Zalmay Khalilzad, see http://emperors-clothes.com/archive/khalilzad-facts.htm
For more on the calculated creation of a Muslim extremist apparatus in Afghanistan in the 1980s by the US and Saudi Arabia, see the Washington Post's analysis at http://emperors-clothes.com/docs/anatomy.htm
The Brzezinski interview follows.
-- Jared Israel
Editor, Emperor's Clothes
***
Brzezinski's Interview with Le Nouvel Observateur
Le Nouvel Observateur: Former CIA director Robert Gates states in his memoirs: The American secret services began six months before the Soviet intervention to support the Mujahideen [in Afghanistan]. At that time you were president Carters security advisor; thus you played a key role in this affair. Do you confirm this statement?
Zbigniew Brzezinski: Yes. According to the official version, the CIA's support for the Mujahideen began in 1980, i.e. after the Soviet army's invasion of Afghanistan on 24 December 1979. But the reality, which was kept secret until today, is completely different: Actually it was on 3 July 1979 that president Carter signed the first directive for the secret support of the opposition against the pro-Soviet regime in Kabul. And on the same day I wrote a note, in which I explained to the president that this support would in my opinion lead to a military intervention by the Soviets.
Le Nouvel Observateur: Despite this risk you were a supporter of this covert action? But perhaps you expected the Soviets to enter this war and tried to provoke it?
Zbigniew Brzezinski: It's not exactly like that. We didn't push the Russians to intervene but we knowingly increased the probability that they would do it.
Le Nouvel Observateur: When the Soviets justified their intervention with the statement that they were fighting against a secret US interference in Afghanistan, nobody believed them. Nevertheless there was a core of truth to this...Do you regret nothing today?
Zbigniew Brzezinski: Regret what? This secret operation was an excellent idea. It lured the Russians into the Afghan trap, and you would like me to regret that? On the day when the Soviets officially crossed the border, I wrote president Carter, in essence: "We now have the opportunity to provide the USSR with their Viet Nam war." Indeed for ten years Moscow had to conduct a war that was intolerable for the regime, a conflict which involved the demoralization and finally the breakup of the Soviet Empire.
Le Nouvel Observateur: And also, don't you regret having helped future terrorists, having given them weapons and advice?
Zbigniew Brzezinski: What is most important for world history? The Taliban or the fall of the Soviet Empire? Some Islamic hotheads or the liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?
Le Nouvel Observateur: "Some hotheads?" But it has been said time and time again: today Islamic fundamentalism represents a world-wide threat...
Zbigniew Brzezinski: Rubbish! It's said that the West has a global policy regarding Islam. That's hogwash: there is no global Islam. Let's look at Islam in a rational and not a demagogic or emotional way. It is the first world religion with 1.5 billion adherents. But what is there in common between fundamentalist Saudi Arabia, moderate Morocco, militaristic Pakistan, pro-Western Egypt and secularized Central Asia? Nothing more than that which connects the Christian countries...
* Footnotes and Further Reading
[1] Regarding Alija Izetbegovic's Muslim extremism, see "Who was Alija Izetbegovic? Moderate 'George Washington' of Bosnia or Islamist Murderer?" http://emperors-clothes.com/bosnia/izet.htm
[2]Regarding the Pro-Yugoslav Muslims who allied with the Bosnian Serbs, thus giving the lie to the charge that the Serbs were religious bigots, see "Pro-Yugoslav Muslim Leader Put on Trial," at http://emperors-clothes.com/docs/abdic.htm
[3] Regarding Khalilzad's role in the Pentagon under the first Bush administration, go to http://emperors-clothes.com/archive/khalilzad-facts.htm#head
* Regarding the Dutch intelligence report on the Pentagon's coordination of intervention in Bosnia by Muslim states (especially Iran) see http://emperors-clothes.com/analysis/deja.htm#dutch
[4]Regarding Khalilzad choosing the Afghan government, see http://emperors-clothes.com/archive/khalilzad-facts.htm#3
Regarding the top level conference where the US and Iran cooperated to design an Afghan constitution based on Muslim religious law, see "The IDLO, Backed by the US and Iran, Planned Muslim rule for Afghanistan," at
http://emperors-clothes.com/news/idlo.htm
The strategy Brzezinski helped develop is the key to understanding U.S. government actions today. See:
* "Why has USAID been Shipping Muslim Extremist Schoolbooks into Afghanistan...for 20 Years?" at http://emperors-clothes.com/articles/jared/jihad.htm
* 'Why Washington Wants Afghanistan' by Jared Israel, Rick Rozoff & Nico Varkevisser at http://emperors-clothes.com/analysis/afghan.htm
i laughed my ass off yesterday. About 5 minutes after obama announced that, they released photos from the raid:
(http://static.infowars.com/2011/05/i/article-images/04oblraid-1.jpg)
(http://static.infowars.com/2011/05/i/article-images/04oblraid-2.jpg)
(http://static.infowars.com/2011/05/i/article-images/04oblraid-3.jpg)
(http://static.infowars.com/2011/05/i/article-images/04oblraid-4.jpg)
(http://static.infowars.com/2011/05/i/article-images/04oblraid-5.jpg)
(http://static.infowars.com/2011/05/i/article-images/04oblraid-6.jpg)
(http://static.infowars.com/2011/05/i/article-images/04oblraid-7.jpg)
(http://static.infowars.com/2011/05/i/article-images/04oblraid-8.jpg)
of course, no osama though. Note the tail piece from the supposed "stealth black hawk" helicopter.
Anyways, they story keeps changing as the week unfolds...we won't be getting any photos and now, we won't be able to see the "live footage" they said they were watching. Apparently, they didn't even get that.
'PHOTO OP:
(http://cdn.theatlantic.com/static/mt/assets/jeffreygoldberg/assets_c/2011/05/sitroom%20photo-thumb-600x400-49711-thumb-600x400-49714.jpg)
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8493391/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Blackout-during-raid-on-bin-Laden-compound.html
Quote
The head of the CIA admitted yesterday that there was no live video footage of the raid on Osama bin Laden's compound as further doubts emerged about the US version of events.
Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, revealed there was a 25 minute blackout during which the live feed from cameras mounted on the helmets of the US special forces was cut off.
A photograph released by the White House appeared to show the President and his aides in the situation room watching the action as it unfolded. In fact they had little knowledge of what was happening in the compound.
(http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p182/Brocke1964/bumper-change-hope.jpg)
i had no strong feelings towards all of this. but when i wake up at morning and get to hear that one of the worlds most dangerous criminals as been send to his precious virgins, i cant think how this makes the whole world a worse place to live.
that said i cant relate to those celebrating his death (i even think they behave like islamists with their cult and love for death). its not even close to an event like the liberation of nazi germany. terrorism is still a persisting threat and i dont care if more people die in bathtubs. last time i checked, we differ between murderer and accidental death, right?
oh and then there are those who secretly admired bin ladin for his "resistance" against the usa and now mourn about his death or call the navy seals a bunch of terrorists.
not to forget the lovely people from the conspiracy community for which such a event is always a win-win situation. if there is no photo-evidence of osamas death than the whole story must be a fraud according to them. but if there is a piece of evidence, then its totally faked by the intelligence service.
oh yeah
war was not the answer
So they still had radio contact. It's not like they were out of the loop. Either they all were sitting there listening and waiting for video, or they were that involved in watching the NBA playoffs.
Quote from: Jerry_Curls on May 05, 2011, 02:44 PM
Anyways, they story keeps changing as the week unfolds...we won't be getting any photos and now, we won't be able to see the "live footage" they said they were watching. Apparently, they didn't even get that.
'PHOTO OP:
(http://cdn.theatlantic.com/static/mt/assets/jeffreygoldberg/assets_c/2011/05/sitroom%20photo-thumb-600x400-49711-thumb-600x400-49714.jpg)
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8493391/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Blackout-during-raid-on-bin-Laden-compound.html
Quote
The head of the CIA admitted yesterday that there was no live video footage of the raid on Osama bin Laden's compound as further doubts emerged about the US version of events.
Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, revealed there was a 25 minute blackout during which the live feed from cameras mounted on the helmets of the US special forces was cut off.
A photograph released by the White House appeared to show the President and his aides in the situation room watching the action as it unfolded. In fact they had little knowledge of what was happening in the compound.
(http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p182/Brocke1964/bumper-change-hope.jpg)
it's seriously been "apparently" this and "supposedly" that. it's beginning to feel like no one seems to understand or know what is going on. i do think america has changed slightly after bush left office. you don't have a blubbering fool for a president.
(http://static.prisonplanet.com/p/images/may2011/050511top2.jpg)
Hilary Clinton even said that here hand was there because of allergies and not shock hahaha.
Are you just all motherfucking blind
(http://geeko.lesoir.be/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/enhanced-buzz-4326-1304444399-7.jpg)
that's what i'm talkin 'bout.
his hands are very... white.
(http://geeko.lesoir.be/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/tumblr_lknul9o9xi1qccqwvo1_r2_500-285x400.jpg)
Lolz. Some of you are ridiculous.
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:52 AM
He was WAY out of the Al-Qaida loop a long time ago.
How so?
Quote from: Inkblades on May 06, 2011, 08:01 PM
Quote from: Variable on May 02, 2011, 07:52 AM
He was WAY out of the Al-Qaida loop a long time ago.
How so?
Told me on twitter. Guy was tired of all that crap.
Who give a shit...
I took almost 10years to catch a fella on diaysis.
I always find it funny people who wear camouflage in the desert.
why? because you think orange jump suites would look better?
I thought a better idea would have been something 'sand' coloured.
Just a thought
http://www.thenationonlineng.net/2011/index.php/news/5348-al-qaeda-confirms-bin-laden%E2%80%99s-death.html (http://www.thenationonlineng.net/2011/index.php/news/5348-al-qaeda-confirms-bin-laden%E2%80%99s-death.html)
Justice for Osama (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzD-rnmeiH8&feature=feedu#)
Quote from: Nailec on May 08, 2011, 02:18 PM
Justice for Osama (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzD-rnmeiH8&feature=feedu#)
WIN!
Quote from: indychinoluv on May 08, 2011, 01:40 AM
I thought a better idea would have been something 'sand' coloured.
Just a thought
I have no idea what you're talking about. Everybody wears desert camouflage.
I'm going to assume that you're referring to videos of Bin Laden wearing green camouflage in Afghanistan. When I was in the mountains of Afghanistan, I wore green camouflage too. Because they are green mountains, not a desert. Most of Afghanistan is green trees and big mountains, not a desert. Please un-ignorant yourself before you speak again.
Quote from: theis on May 08, 2011, 02:56 PM
Quote from: Nailec on May 08, 2011, 02:18 PM
Justice for Osama (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzD-rnmeiH8&feature=feedu#)
WIN!
I liked just about everything that he said except the part about how "islam is at war with America." That might be slightly inaccurate
its amazing what can be accomplished when the playstation network is down.
Haha, that stupid ass dickcheeseburger had a bunch of porn. Any guesses what kind?
Quote from: deftones86 on May 12, 2011, 04:23 AM
its amazing what can be accomplished when the playstation network is down.
HAH!
Quote from: poofing acid on May 14, 2011, 01:04 PM
Haha, that stupid ass dickcheeseburger had a bunch of porn. Any guesses what kind?
2 girls 1 cup. shit like that. he seems like a fetish kind of guy.
The Naked Gun Opening (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oEA6zK_8u8&feature=player_embedded#ws)