Quote from: Yoi Yes Kokan on Feb 26, 2016, 04:57 AMI have somthing for you to "LMAO" about. first off all poltergeist is their heaviest song and second of all as for being a new fan, you don't even know the song GIFT which is why I put that in my original post because i know how you baseheads think around here, I can predict your every move.

please go back to reddit

whatever that is, i don't get the joke, don't make me waste a post.

Quote from: MrVesanique on Feb 26, 2016, 08:07 AM

Quote from: Yoi Yes Kokan on Feb 26, 2016, 04:57 AM
first off all poltergeist is their heaviest song

It's like you're asking to be slapped. Seriously, your statement is just plain stupid, and has nothing to do with what side of Deftones one could like better. Pink Maggit is not an aggressive song and is still heavier than Poltergeist.



EDIT : blondie stop that shit

your first sentence was a bunch of hypocritical bullshit. And your second sentence is a great point, and that's the side i like the most in the band and i have no idea but from steph's interview it probably is more emotionally heavy, but who knows maybe he layed down slaughter on the record and made sure not to tell anyone so you could wax un poetic about how you feel about the upcoming release like you are doing.

I hope I don't catch too much heat for being new around here and this post won't have much substance but after being fan of their work since the beginning I'm excited for the direction the band appears to be heading with Gore. It's fun to speculate and assume things but like Steph and Chino said expectations will just let you down. Let's try to be optimistic and be thankful we get blessed with new music and more shows!

old school fans? first of all, if i meet someone who just discovered them, im jealous of all the new amazing music they get to discover, finding the deftones is finding an emerald. I've bought every record since white pony the day it came out, who cares? I know all of their shit and I just mentioned the song Gift and everyone backed off and acted like i made it up because even the biggest nerds couldn't compete with that knowledge.

I love the last two records the most, i love all their records and they've all been my favorite at one time or another, but what they're doing now is a perfection of what they've been doing, everyone is on their A game, i haven't heard the new album but i pray it's melodic with wordplay and nice riffs throughout, not chino or stef taking it too much of one direction, that's been that last two albums and it's the perfect balance.

Quote from: MrVesanique on Feb 26, 2016, 09:18 AM
I'm convinced Stef isn't so much about plain aggressivity. It's just the actual art behind it, man. If you remember well, fans used to take pride in the fact they were never an image band. You couldn't say so today, most of their songs are produced to conform at least slightly to radio standards. How mindblowing is that when you think the singer of the same band bashed a radio station on a documentary because they took screams away from a song?

Admit it, Deftones might still create effective and somewhat catchy music, but that music is never going to put you in that trance like it used do. And it has nothing to do with nostalgia. The stuff just doesn't have that necessary "purity", lacking a better word.

That's actually a really interesting discussion point - does the current music have the same grab that the old music had?

I think Diamond Eyes and Koi No Yokan are really good records. They're great bits of work, that capture their own vibe and make it into two strong, cohesive albums. I play Diamond Eyes probably every couple of months and I do the same with Koi No Yokan.

At the same time, I just don't feel as strong a connection with the songs as I do with the ones on Around The Fur, White Pony and the self-titled. Koi No Yokan's a good demonstration of this - it kind of reminds of a movie soundtrack in some ways and for what it is, I think it's really well done. But THAT is the reason why it doesn't quite match up to the three aforementioned albums. With Koi No Yokan, I'll switch it on in my house and really enjoy it; with White Pony, I'll listen to it on my headphones with my eyes closed and feel like I've been transported to another world. The former I simply enjoy listening to, the latter will put me in a trance.

That's barely a criticism I might add - literally no other band has impacted me more than Deftones have on Around The Fur, White Pony and the self-titled. I actually think it's basically impossible to keep up such perfection. I just think the days of Deftones creating that level of music on a consistent basis are probably over. It doesn't mean they won't write great albums and it doesn't mean they'll never write another album that matches up to that (maybe Gore will!) but it's not an expectation now. My expectation going into a new Deftones album is simply that it will be really good and I don't think they'll ever disappoint me on that level.

Quote from: Yoi Yes Kokan on Feb 26, 2016, 11:36 AM
I know all of their shit and I just mentioned the song Gift and everyone backed off and acted like i made it up because even the biggest nerds couldn't compete with that knowledge.

Dude, everybody knows that song.
*edit: Yeah, probably trolling.

Quote from: LG95 on Feb 26, 2016, 12:13 PM

Quote from: MrVesanique on Feb 26, 2016, 09:18 AM
I'm convinced Stef isn't so much about plain aggressivity. It's just the actual art behind it, man. If you remember well, fans used to take pride in the fact they were never an image band. You couldn't say so today, most of their songs are produced to conform at least slightly to radio standards. How mindblowing is that when you think the singer of the same band bashed a radio station on a documentary because they took screams away from a song?

Admit it, Deftones might still create effective and somewhat catchy music, but that music is never going to put you in that trance like it used do. And it has nothing to do with nostalgia. The stuff just doesn't have that necessary "purity", lacking a better word.

At the same time, I just don't feel as strong a connection with the songs as I do with the ones on Around The Fur, White Pony and the self-titled. Koi No Yokan's a good demonstration of this - it kind of reminds of a movie soundtrack in some ways and for what it is, I think it's really well done. But THAT is the reason why it doesn't quite match up to the three aforementioned albums. With Koi No Yokan, I'll switch it on in my house and really enjoy it; with White Pony, I'll listen to it on my headphones with my eyes closed and feel like I've been transported to another world. The former I simply enjoy listening to, the latter will put me in a trance.

People feel a stonger connection to earlier music by bands because of age. Its not 100% that the music in the later albums catalog is bad. Its that the "less of a connection" feeling is from having more life experiences, growing older, and putting into perspective the level of how much you live in "new music" as your world.

The person gets older and disconnected to the passion they once experienced of something new. Hence, the big nostalgia feeling of listening to your favorite older tracks. It's not always that the music gets worse.

Quote from: RavinVsFlud on Feb 26, 2016, 12:35 PM

Quote from: LG95 on Feb 26, 2016, 12:13 PM

Quote from: MrVesanique on Feb 26, 2016, 09:18 AM
I'm convinced Stef isn't so much about plain aggressivity. It's just the actual art behind it, man. If you remember well, fans used to take pride in the fact they were never an image band. You couldn't say so today, most of their songs are produced to conform at least slightly to radio standards. How mindblowing is that when you think the singer of the same band bashed a radio station on a documentary because they took screams away from a song?

Admit it, Deftones might still create effective and somewhat catchy music, but that music is never going to put you in that trance like it used do. And it has nothing to do with nostalgia. The stuff just doesn't have that necessary "purity", lacking a better word.

At the same time, I just don't feel as strong a connection with the songs as I do with the ones on Around The Fur, White Pony and the self-titled. Koi No Yokan's a good demonstration of this - it kind of reminds of a movie soundtrack in some ways and for what it is, I think it's really well done. But THAT is the reason why it doesn't quite match up to the three aforementioned albums. With Koi No Yokan, I'll switch it on in my house and really enjoy it; with White Pony, I'll listen to it on my headphones with my eyes closed and feel like I've been transported to another world. The former I simply enjoy listening to, the latter will put me in a trance.

People feel a stonger connection to earlier music by bands because of age. Its not 100% that the music in the later albums catalog is bad. Its that the "less of a connection" feeling is from having more life experiences, growing older, and putting into perspective the level of how much you live in "new music" as your world.

The person gets older and disconnected to the passion they once experienced of something new. Hence, the big nostalgia feeling of listening to your favorite older tracks. It's not always that the music gets worse.

Mate, in this case it's 100% about the music. I got into Deftones about a year or two after Saturday Night Wrist came out so it's not to do with me listening to the older albums when they came out and the nostalgia I have about that; it's simply that the early albums are fucking incredible. Around The Fur-White Pony-Deftones is my favourite three-album run by any band ever.

Again, I love DE and KNY. It's just those albums don't have the same resonance with me as the older ones do and that's entirely down to the music.

Quote from: MrVesanique on Feb 26, 2016, 12:46 PM
It won't surprise anyone but that's exactly where I disagree. Having watched tons of live footage from various eras of various bands, I've seen this discussion a ridiculous amount of times. It's always the "you can't move on vs. the new music sucks". I mean, it's basic, it happens with every band, every artist, every individual rapper who goes from spitting dark shit on great productions to babble about chewing gum in the mountains on recycled beats. It's happened with Deftones everytime they released a record after Around the Fur.

The thing is, it's not universal, as RavinVSFlud hinted. It's not always the music. And it is the lack of life experiences that makes some people concentrate on the old stuff and only the old stuff, but there again, not always.

As for Deftones, I think the death of their trademark headbanging metal bassist, added to a monopoly of creative input held by the singer, actually diminished their abilities, and that Diamond Eyes and Koi No Yokan are not solely directed to a new sound that throws some people off, they actually have something missing. A song doesn't need to be tragic or talking about how life is a pain to have a deep sounding layer. Gift might be the most positive sounding Deftones song I've ever heard, and I fucking love it. It's spontaneous, it doesn't try to match a standard, it just does what it intents to do. And it has a fucking flute, for fuck's sake.

I've said it before and I'll say it again : I really like Diamond Eyes. I loved it at the release but later on realized I was just hyped to hear my favorite band again. I didn't feel a soul on it like I did with previous releases but I appreciated the stunning musical work on it. I've been to several Diamond Eyes shows and absolutely lost my shit on some of the songs. And if I don't like Koi No Yokan, it's because I think there was truly something better to be done, not because it's a happy sounding record. I love happy sounding records, when they're well made, just like dark music. I don't think Koi No Yokan was well made and composed. I think it was made way too quick, the arrangements sound too easy and some of Chino's vocal influences are way too obvious on lots of choruses. No need to call me out for this, it's my respectful, genuine opinion on the record and it's probably never changing, so don't waste your time.


(No I don't mean that Deftones songs all need flute, don't twist it)

This is a really good point. I hadn't thought of it from this perspective. Lots of good points you made here in this comment! The level of variables involved in life between the fanatic and the musicians is emmense! Including explaining the nature of how music effects us, inspiration, tone/sound, creativity, etc.

when i see newbie Deftones fans trying to tell me DE and KNY are their 2 heaviest albums ever made...I truly want to bitchslap them....must be what Metallica fans went through when new fans thought the Black album was their heaviest album....problem is Chino is to blame for these posers. He has conformed to the mainstream. words cant describe how much I hate Crosses and think Lopez has corrupted him...get Chino an 8 ball of blow and i guarantee you the next Tones record will be back to 2003 era

Quote from: jaypayton on Feb 26, 2016, 05:42 PM
when i see newbie Deftones fans trying to tell me DE and KNY are their 2 heaviest albums ever made...I truly want to bitchslap them....must be what Metallica fans went through when new fans thought the Black album was their heaviest album....problem is Chino is to blame for these posers. He has conformed to the mainstream. words cant describe how much I hate Crosses and think Lopez has corrupted him...get Chino an 8 ball of blow and i guarantee you the next Tones record will be back to 2003 era

I hate elitist fans like you trowing around the term poser.  What are ya, in grade school still or something.   You wouldn't know heavy even if I dropped my 100lb sack on your head.  White Pony has to be the most overrated album in Deftones catalog.  After digital bath I have to skip to Knife party and then I can listen all the way through.   

Self-Titled is the heaviest and best thing they've done and then  I'd pick Diamond Eyes.  I don't have to skip a single song on those.  Around the Fur is the same

Quote from: Penicks on Feb 26, 2016, 07:23 AM

Quote from: Yoi Yes Kokan on Feb 26, 2016, 04:57 AMI have somthing for you to "LMAO" about. first off all poltergeist is their heaviest song and second of all as for being a new fan, you don't even know the song GIFT which is why I put that in my original post because i know how you baseheads think around here, I can predict your every move.

please go back to reddit

The fuck is that supposed to mean?

"kindly take your shit to the biggest cesspool"

Anticipated album rankings.

Adrenaline = WP = KNY > ATF = SNW = Eros (guess) = DE = Gore (guess) > S/T

If the song lengths currently posted on the wiki are correct, there's a possibility the band took a step back from the progression they made on KNY and declined  to create those interesting intros/outros found on the previous album. Step backward in my opinion. Want to see these dudes make a true progressive masterpiece album linking songs from start to finish.

A couple quick points I want to make:

1. Yeah, there's just no way DE and KNY are their heaviest records. That's clearly Adrenaline and ATF. Why? Almost every song on those two albums has pummeling riffs and Chino screaming his head off for extended periods of time.

2. I also wouldn't say S/T is their heaviest album. However, I would say it's one of their darker records, along with White Pony. To me, there is a difference between a dark sound and a heavy sound.

3. V, I agree with you that KNY is the least of their albums and definitely has something missing, but can we put all the blame on Chino? Maybe some, but we also have to look at Steph for coming up with a lot of bland and uninspired riffs. I mean, he's pretty much even admitting he doesn't care about getting better and he didn't want to play on Gore.

i keep comparing it to Faith No More...Jim Martin was the resident metal guy in that band who wanted them to go more and more into metal..near the end when Mike Patton took over the band and pushed them into a more experimental/extreme territory, Martin just quietly did nothing, didnt write any heavy riffs, contributed nothing, and then bitched and moaned in interviews how he doesnt like the direction the band is going in and doesnt relate to the music anymore..then during live shows would just stand in the side and twiddle his wrists....he was gone within a year....its like de ja vu

Quote from: Penicks on Feb 26, 2016, 07:21 PM
"kindly take your shit to the biggest cesspool"

kindly go eat a bag of dicks

sorry, i'm sure those guys are way more appreciative of your amazing findings with your production grade headphones

Quote from: Penicks on Feb 26, 2016, 08:18 PM
sorry, i'm sure those guys are way more appreciative of your amazing findings with your production grade headphones

Wow, this community is starting to suck. I try to share something I found and you all berate me for it.